Ghost Fell Off & Became Boring

Sons is entitled to his opinion. Evendough its wrong, like gay man pregnant with twins. Sure Ghost has taken this though coke-selling-don-guy-who-still-cooks-for-his-lady-friend a bit to the extreme. But that's his shit. And within those lines, ain't nobody doin' like Ghost.

The rap game is filled, I repeat FILLED with coke rappers who seem to just waked up in a Scarface seqeunce while Cuban Linx is playing in the back. Even Busta is doin' it, goddamned! Why is Ghost still relevant? Why is even needed then.. The originality of coming off fresh in tired evironment.

And am not even goin' start about tracks like Whip You With A Strap & Underwater.

Still, I kinda agree with dude. I think that anything after Fishscale (am goin to ignore More Fish, sue me) would cost Ghost some props if he get on the same ol horse again.

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Originally Posted by noel411

Why do you have to be so fuckin' ridiculous? Are you actually trying to pretend you don't see the absurdity of that post?

Let's go back to my first post. I said Ghost has lost appeal and his last few albums are boring and average. This is my OPINION. There is nothing to back up. Do I have to prove I really have this opinion? Ok, none of his albums since SC has made me want to continue listening to them after the first few listens, and very little he has done on any of those albums has impressed me. Can you accept that? Or are you gonna continue to come up with absurd bullshit about how I'm not allowed to say things like that?

The other thing I said is that a lot of his lyrics on recent albums are the same as what other commercial artists are writing. Hmmm, ok, this is more than just an opinion, so how can I prove it? Well, let's see. I could just find lyrics from a handful of Ghost songs and also a few songs by other commercial artists, of a similar nature, and post them here for comparison. But wait a second, anybody with the slightest bit of sense can see that that really wouldn't prove a thing. I'm sure even an utter fucking idiot would realise that you could do the same thing with almost any artist. Damn, there goes that idea. I guess I'd really have to dig up a solid portion of Ghost's recent lyrics and find a good many tracks from several commercial artists with similar lyrics to actually prove my point. But wait a second, I really couldn't be fucked doing that just to make a point to a couple of guys who can't accept the fact that someone doesn't like Ghost. After all, I was only making an observation to see how other people felt about it. I never considered that anybody would be so troubled by it that they would hassle me with bullshit non-stop, forcing me to repeat myself time and time again.

Do you understand my logic?

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So basically you shouldn't throw out pointless phrases like "he's just like other commercial/mainstream rappers" if you can't follow it up when someone asks a simple "Can you give me an example?"

Remember, YOU were the one who threw that statement out there, no one coaxed it out of you.

You either feel Ghost, or you don't. So what's the point of adding complete nonsense as of a way, somehow, validating your point of view?

That's the point that, somehow, you keep not getting. And that was the only point I was questioning (Well that, and your whole "no one else said anything relevant that didn't go with what I'm saying" statement).

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Originally Posted by hide1998

So basically you shouldn't throw out pointless phrases like "he's just like other commercial/mainstream rappers" if you can't follow it up when someone asks a simple "Can you give me an example?"

Remember, YOU were the one who threw that statement out there, no one coaxed it out of you.

You either feel Ghost, or you don't. So what's the point of adding complete nonsense as of a way, somehow, validating your point of view?

That's the point that, somehow, you keep not getting. And that was the only point I was questioning (Well that, and your whole "no one else said anything relevant that didn't go with what I'm saying" statement).

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You know, you are getting quite ridiculous. You seem to be the one not getting it, or not wanting to get it bc Noel has the audacity to be tired of Ghost's style at the moment. And I really don't want to defend Noel bc he's a complete ass, but you seem to be thinking that his posts are somewhat lacking while yours have some substance, which is far from reality.

He stated his opinion. He also told the situation of him reading the lyrics to "Ghostface" without the hook and not knowing who it was and thinking it was some GUnit, Dipset, insert all the carbon copy rappers here. Which is true. If you listen to some of Ghost's newer lyrics, they are dumbed down. Noel stated he doesnt like it and thinks it's bullshit. That's simple enough to understand for most people. You keep saying he hasn't given examples and ask for more. You don't need more, you should get the jist already. It's not a mistake on his explaining, it's your understanding or not wanting to understand what he said.

In addition to this ,Ghost in interviews has said himself he has and is dumbing down his lyrics for the most part. So the man himself says so. Now you can still thoroughly enjoy his stuff, that's fine. But the fact is he HAS dumbed down his music and tried to be more radio friendly. A lot of Wu Fans wont be into it. They have a valid point.

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Originally Posted by cd

You know, you are getting quite ridiculous. You seem to be the one not getting it, or not wanting to get it bc Noel has the audacity to be tired of Ghost's style at the moment. And I really don't want to defend Noel bc he's a complete ass, but you seem to be thinking that his posts are somewhat lacking while yours have some substance, which is far from reality.

He stated his opinion. He also told the situation of him reading the lyrics to "Ghostface" without the hook and not knowing who it was and thinking it was some GUnit, Dipset, insert all the carbon copy rappers here. Which is true. If you listen to some of Ghost's newer lyrics, they are dumbed down. Noel stated he doesnt like it and thinks it's bullshit. That's simple enough to understand for most people. You keep saying he hasn't given examples and ask for more. You don't need more, you should get the jist already. It's not a mistake on his explaining, it's your understanding or not wanting to understand what he said.

In addition to this ,Ghost in interviews has said himself he has and is dumbing down his lyrics for the most part. So the man himself says so. Now you can still thoroughly enjoy his stuff, that's fine. But the fact is he HAS dumbed down his music and tried to be more radio friendly. A lot of Wu Fans wont be into it. They have a valid point.

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Did you not read my posts, and his posts?

He bluntly stated (more than once in fact), that Ghostface is like all the other mainstream/commercial hip-hop (the example he pointed out was G-Unit). He was then asked (not JUST by me, but we'll pretend I was the only one to simplify things) to give an example. He (noel) backs out, and oddly enough says he doesn't listen to the radio. Then goes BACK to saying Ghostface is just like what he hears on the radio (every other commercial/mainstream artists). He's AGAIN asked to give an example what he means and he (noel) gets all antsy about a point HE brought up that HE can't backup.

THAT was the point I was attacking (well...and the whole "no one has anything of substance that didn't go along with what I was already saying" reference).

I'm not missing a thing as far as the very specific point I was aiming for with noel.

You can go back and read how he couldn't backup that specific point (again, I was NOT the only person who asked him to give examples), and how he couldn't back it up at all.

Interestingly enough, in his very last post he openly admits that he's not going to even try to back up that point.

That's the problem when you add unnecessary dirt just for the sake of making your opinion (he doesn't feel Ghostface now like he did during the Ironman days...fair enough) look stronger. When questioned about it, you can't back it up, and end up having to just back out of it altogether.

Notice how in none of my posts did I ever say, "noel you're wrong for feeling Ghostface more during his Ironman days than how is is these days."

You think noel's a jerk. I, personally, don't know enough about him on this board. But I do find it interesting how brings up things that he can't back out like the whole Ghostface/G-Unit thing *shrugs*

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Originally Posted by hide1998

Did you not read my posts, and his posts?

He bluntly stated (more than once in fact), that Ghostface is like all the other mainstream/commercial hip-hop (the example he pointed out was G-Unit). He was then asked (not JUST by me, but we'll pretend I was the only one to simplify things) to give an example. He (noel) backs out, and oddly enough says he doesn't listen to the radio. Then goes BACK to saying Ghostface is just like what he hears on the radio (every other commercial/mainstream artists). He's AGAIN asked to give an example what he means and he (noel) gets all antsy about a point HE brought up that HE can't backup.

THAT was the point I was attacking (well...and the whole "no one has anything of substance that didn't go along with what I was already saying" reference).

I'm not missing a thing as far as the very specific point I was aiming for with noel.

You can go back and read how he couldn't backup that specific point (again, I was NOT the only person who asked him to give examples), and how he couldn't back it up at all.

Interestingly enough, in his very last post he openly admits that he's not going to even try to back up that point.

That's the problem when you add unnecessary dirt just for the sake of making your opinion (he doesn't feel Ghostface now like he did during the Ironman days...fair enough) look stronger. When questioned about it, you can't back it up, and end up having to just back out of it altogether.

Notice how in none of my posts did I ever say, "noel you're wrong for feeling Ghostface more during his Ironman days than how is is these days."

You think noel's a jerk. I, personally, don't know enough about him on this board. But I do find it interesting how brings up things that he can't back out like the whole Ghostface/G-Unit thing *shrugs*

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Wow, you really don't want to read or understand what anyone is saying do you? You just want to try and force your point which is completely off, thinking if you rant long enough, it will be true.

He DID give you guys a very specific example. You choose to ignore it and then keep repeatedly asking for more examples. If you're going to ignore the one, why should he bother with digging up more? You are trying to twist things and it's tranparent and pointless. He also explained to you about the radio comment.

Just bc one doesn't listen to the radio, doesn't mean that you don't end up hearing it. He explained this to you. He doesn't listen to the radio himself but ends up hearing it when other people play it. This is another point he explained but you again choose to ignore what you want and try to use it as a point against him. This further twisting makes you look either dishonest or just unable to comprehend what he is saying. I never listen to the radio myself, but end up hearing it often, not a difficult concept to grasp.

And once again, bc you choose to ignore it also, GHOST HIMSELF has said he has dumbed down his rhymes. Another fact that is the basis for what Noel has stated, and you ignore. He has given an example, you just feel differently which is fine, it's all taste and opinion, but to say he hasn't backed anything up at all is bordering on delusional.

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Originally Posted by Sherz

Sons is entitled to his opinion. Evendough its wrong, like gay man pregnant with twins. Sure Ghost has taken this though coke-selling-don-guy-who-still-cooks-for-his-lady-friend a bit to the extreme. But that's his shit. And within those lines, ain't nobody doin' like Ghost.

The rap game is filled, I repeat FILLED with coke rappers who seem to just waked up in a Scarface seqeunce while Cuban Linx is playing in the back. Even Busta is doin' it, goddamned! Why is Ghost still relevant? Why is even needed then.. The originality of coming off fresh in tired evironment.

And am not even goin' start about tracks like Whip You With A Strap & Underwater.

Still, I kinda agree with dude. I think that anything after Fishscale (am goin to ignore More Fish, sue me) would cost Ghost some props if he get on the same ol horse again.

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opinions dont have right or wrong answer im afraid ... thats why theyre called opinions ... this thread keeps on keepin on ... shit ... why is it so hard to admit ghost has dumbed down his shit ?

hide1998, I have said everything I need to say to you. You either can’t or won’t comprehend what I’m saying to you, and I am no longer willing to waste my time repeating myself to you. On top of this cd has also tried explaining the fact that you are repeatedly choosing to dismiss and neglect everything I say, despite the fact that I have explained everything to you in a reasonable manner.

If you’re as unsettled by all this as you appear to be, just read the last couple of pages over and over and you’ll get it eventually.

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Originally Posted by Tonearm_Terrorwrist

opinions dont have right or wrong answer im afraid ... thats why theyre called opinions ... this thread keeps on keepin on ... shit ... why is it so hard to admit ghost has dumbed down his shit ?

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u answered it urself lol

ITS JUST UR OPINION, WHICH MEANS IT DOESNT HAVE A RIGHT OR WRONG ANSWER

listen to the tracks he did with DOOM, Angeles, and Alex, thats him, as creative as ever. Hes just dumbing down a bit for Def Jam

this thread spiralled...

ghost has changed, some people like it some dont, simple.

if you cant admit he has changed from SC to Fishscale then your opinion is wrong.

Although noel hasn't showed at all how Ghostface is like G-Unit (the example HE brought up), let alone like the rest of mainstream/commercial hip-hop, I really haven't a single problem with him feeling Ghostface more back in the day. That's his business. Since this board isn't noel's personal blog, making a topic entitled "Ghost Fell Off & Became Boring" without expecting people to say more than "You're right son!" doesn't make sense. Apparently I'm, as of right now, the only person really calling him out for making unrealistic comparisons in a way of adding strength to his words. Just because he throws something out there, doesn't make it so. If he listens to the radio whenever he goes to a friends how then that completely contradicts what he stated initially.
All this "Ghost admits he dumbed down his lyrics" is completely irrelevant because at NO point did I make an argument like "noel, Ghostface is much more complex rapper nowadays than he was back in the day, therefore you can't possibly feel him more back in the day than you do now." Bringing up things like that further diverts from the point I was specifically going at (btw, how is a hook from a song like "Ghostface" anything like G-Unit? People are harping on that like that's noel's example for comparison. Strange. I guess Z-ro is like Nelly. How so? Well..they both harmonize, so that's what makes them similar. Of course it doesn't, but apparently that falls as a good comparison in this thread). noel's support in this thread is pretty clear, so I gotta give him props for finding people to back him up even after he hasn't proved anything (again, I have NOT at any point stated "noel, you're wrong for feeling Ghostface more back in the day.")

I find offense with that statement^^^^ I tried but gave up

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Originally Posted by hide1998

Although noel hasn't showed at all how Ghostface is like G-Unit (the example HE brought up), let alone like the rest of mainstream/commercial hip-hop, I really haven't a single problem with him feeling Ghostface more back in the day. That's his business. Since this board isn't noel's personal blog, making a topic entitled "Ghost Fell Off & Became Boring" without expecting people to say more than "You're right son!" doesn't make sense. Apparently I'm, as of right now, the only person really calling him out for making unrealistic comparisons in a way of adding strength to his words. Just because he throws something out there, doesn't make it so. If he listens to the radio whenever he goes to a friends how then that completely contradicts what he stated initially.
All this "Ghost admits he dumbed down his lyrics" is completely irrelevant because at NO point did I make an argument like "noel, Ghostface is much more complex rapper nowadays than he was back in the day, therefore you can't possibly feel him more back in the day than you do now." Bringing up things like that further diverts from the point I was specifically going at (btw, how is a hook from a song like "Ghostface" anything like G-Unit? People are harping on that like that's noel's example for comparison. Strange. I guess Z-ro is like Nelly. How so? Well..they both harmonize, so that's what makes them similar. Of course it doesn't, but apparently that falls as a good comparison in this thread). noel's support in this thread is pretty clear, so I gotta give him props for finding people to back him up even after he hasn't proved anything (again, I have NOT at any point stated "noel, you're wrong for feeling Ghostface more back in the day.")

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I see you’re still troubled by these same “issues”. I guess you didn’t follow the advice of my last post. Seriously dude, if this shit is troubling you so much please just re-read the thread. There are repeated reasonable and valid explanations for all these things you have issues with. I assure you. Just keep looking and eventually you will see it. You may need to let go of your perceived depiction of what I am saying and keep trying over and over until you actually see my words for what they are, but if that’s what it takes to give you peace of mind then it might not be such a bad idea.


As for you being the only one "calling me out", did you ever stop to think that maybe this is because you are the only person here having difficulty interpreting what I'm saying, or recognising the validity of my explanations for all these supposed flaws you are making up?

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Originally Posted by Sun Tzu, Tha Soul Controllah

u answered it urself lol

ITS JUST UR OPINION, WHICH MEANS IT DOESNT HAVE A RIGHT OR WRONG ANSWER

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so ... ghost admitts he dumbed down his shit so it just becomes my opinion ?

Is this thread a beautifulrock vs Noell Thread?