Ghost Fell Off & Became Boring

How did ghost fall of? if all his album post sc arent even average then you cant possibly think that ANY clan memeber album(besides ghost) after wu forever even reached garbage status. You say that his lyrics are more or less just like other "mainstream" rappers. Which rappers? give me examples homie. Or do you believe that just by saying its enough? Nope. Ghost isint what he use to be....but what do you expect? It's unrealistic and unfair to expect an ironman/sc level of consistancy. Besides since when has ghostfaces' lyrics been his strenght? He's always been dope lyrically but I always though his strenghts were/are his flow, and delivery. Those two things are the REASON supreme clientele is so dope. If anything ghost reverted back to his earlier day's....the only difference is he can't do some things like he use to. Song's like "beauty jackson" "whip you with a strap" "underwater" "shakey dog" "kilo" prove why ghost is still a dope mc.

IMO you are wrong. Do you see how easy it is to say that? and its even easier to say it when I believe I dont't have to make the effort to back up my "opinion".

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Originally Posted by Jeru

beautiful rock, you're basing your opinions on critics and now on albumsales.

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What am I supposed to base it on, you assholes?

Actually I use that stuff to back my opinion, which is formed from actually listening to those albums 100's of times but thanks for assuming I just picked up rolling stone one day and declared FS the best album ever without listening to it.

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Originally Posted by beautifulrock

What am I supposed to base it on, you assholes?

Actually I use that stuff to back my opinion, which is formed from actually listening to those albums 100's of times but thanks for assuming I just picked up rolling stone one day and declared FS the best album ever without listening to it.

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I was stating the facts, all you did in here was say critics say this so he's a good rapper.Record sales say this so he's a good rapper.I also base my opinions like you said by listening to him.There's no point in trying to convert people who think otherwise.Deal with it.assholes LOL

^hahaha @ Jeru

Hiphop went through a mainstream acceptance change in the last 10 years. There's alot more to stating facts from critics. Fishscale maybe in alot of top tens of hiphop. That just doesn't mean it is a good album. It's popular amongst those peoples. And maybe the rest just wasn't that good or even more terrible.

It's all in context and perspective.


Oyeah, I say GZA went way down. The man can barely hold a conceert any more, let alone rap his own tracks without gasping for breath. Age got teh better of him for some years now. HE made a fool of himself when he was in Amsterdam with the Clan rapping with one hand inside his pants.

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Originally Posted by B O T

well the consensus of this thread is half and half. as i stated before, ghosts listeners are split between love it and hate it without much in between.

where did you get that ghostface is almost gold from? what album, fishscale? that album fell off the hitsdailydouble charts at around 220K. thats not almost gold. its possible that he made up the difference by now but i dont see anywhere that says he's there or almost there.

please dont start using using sales numbers to justify people liking an artist. tical 0 actually DID go gold in a time where wu was putting out wood album after wood album and its hailed by many as his worst album. sales numbers determine who's hot, who people are checking for, but it doesnt mean that every single person who buys an album likes what they purchased. thats evident by this thread.

which is why there is no such thing as an instant classic. only instant hype.

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http://www.wutang-corp.com/forum/sho...highlight=484k

not a soundscan member so I can't be completely sure but he did drop 110,000 the 1st week. So youre tellin me he only doubled that # in a year? I doubt it.

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Originally Posted by beautifulrock

http://www.wutang-corp.com/forum/sho...highlight=484k

not a soundscan member so I can't be completely sure but he did drop 110,000 the 1st week. So youre tellin me he only doubled that # in a year? I doubt it.

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116k actually, and his numbers went down dramatically the second week.

generalwise's word is hardly proof.

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Originally Posted by Jet Set

^hahaha @ Jeru

Hiphop went through a mainstream acceptance change in the last 10 years. There's alot more to stating facts from critics. Fishscale maybe in alot of top tens of hiphop. That just doesn't mean it is a good album. It's popular amongst those peoples. And maybe the rest just wasn't that good or even more terrible.

It's all in context and perspective.


Oyeah, I say GZA went way down. The man can barely hold a conceert any more, let alone rap his own tracks without gasping for breath. Age got teh better of him for some years now. HE made a fool of himself when he was in Amsterdam with the Clan rapping with one hand inside his pants.

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Why hahaha at me?LOL, speaking my mind

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Originally Posted by B O T

116k actually, and his numbers went down dramatically the second week.

generalwise's word is hardly proof.

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if he sold an average of 6000 copies a week after the 1st week, thats 300,000 copies. I can't imagine him not doing at least that. and yes u r right about wise.

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Originally Posted by Jeru

Why hahaha at me?LOL, speaking my mind

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And i thought you said it in a lol way, lol.:p


And if we want to incorporate soundscan numbers in this why don't we focus on his release of singles and how well they did. And how much singles and videos he got. As we are doing this, do acknowledge that the debate is shifting from our general opinion to that of a commercial succes facts one. In my opinion this doesn't say a damn thing about an album nowadays.

A point here is, the hype. Everybody was waiting for this album. It was released, one single one video, and it died. It showed up on top tens, but it wasn't like an all year round hitter. Ghost went out like a fire cracker.

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Originally Posted by beautifulrock

if he sold an average of 6000 copies a week after the 1st week, thats 300,000 copies. I can't imagine him not doing at least that. and yes u r right about wise.

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no one knows what numbers dude did after he fell off the charts. we do know that there hasnt been anything official that says he went gold or is close to it so im just going by what information is there and are not spectulating or conjecting.

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Noel, You are a player hating cum guzzling faggot. ANd I don't mean to insult faggots comparing them to you.

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Don't worry, bundles of sticks have no feelings. Do the knowledge.

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But let's all face something too, sometimes he's always rhymed complete and utter nonsense....sounds good, but Holocaust gets hated on for the same poop.

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This is true, but I am much more entertained by random nonsense than cliche hip hop topics.

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He completely ruins Projects on Forever with his stupid sex rhymes, and his need for singing has to go

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Agree wholeheartedly. Same deal with 'Strawberry', which was the only joint on BPW that had the potential to be really dope. Worst thing was that this shitty verse was recycled on 'The Problem'. As for his singing, it's like fingernails on a chalk board, only so much worse.

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One other thing about Ghost is his ability to make good mainstream tracks. I think Be Easy and Back like that are good

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Although let's not forget the pitiful and shameful efforts of 'Never Be The Same Again', 'Ghostshowers', 'Love Session', and 'Tush'.

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if all his album post sc arent even average then you cant possibly think that ANY clan memeber album(besides ghost) after wu forever even reached garbage status

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"Aren't even average"? Why do people keep exaggerating everything I say? It's incredibly irritating. And dude, just because you might think Ghost's post-'Forever' albums are better than any other Clan member, it doesn't make it the accepted truth. I think Gza's catalogue is far greater than Ghost's.

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You say that his lyrics are more or less just like other "mainstream" rappers. Which rappers? give me examples homie.

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Again I repeat that I don't know mainstream artists. I am talking about mainstream hip hop in general. As in Ghost raps about the same cliche shit you hear on the radio a lot of the time.

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Or do you believe that just by saying its enough?

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I'm not trying to convince anybody. I'm just sharing my observations.

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Oyeah, I say GZA went way down. The man can barely hold a conceert any more, let alone rap his own tracks without gasping for breath. Age got teh better of him for some years now. HE made a fool of himself when he was in Amsterdam with the Clan rapping with one hand inside his pants.

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Yeah, he's definately not what he used to be. I've heard he's put in some very dud live performances in recent years. Fortunately he put on a good show when he came over here last year.

I would just like to say in response of the so-called "stupid sex rhymes" comment, Ghost has always played the overt misogynist perfectly IMO. He picks up where 2 live crew and akinyele started and his rhymes are unforgiving and eye-opening. This is the truest sign of an artist. When you can not only cross the line but erase it all together challenging other artists to go further.

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Originally Posted by beautifulrock

I would just like to say in response of the so-called "stupid sex rhymes" comment, Ghost has always played the overt misogynist perfectly IMO. He picks up where 2 live crew and akinyele started and his rhymes are unforgiving and eye-opening. This is the truest sign of an artist. When you can not only cross the line but erase it all together challenging other artists to go further.

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Ha....now that is funny. Akinyele and the 2 Live Crew have their gimmick which is fine. Ghost on Wildflower or even on Stand Up w/Charlie Baltimore is fine. On other songs where it doesnt fit, no it's not good at all. And at times not done well. When the 2 live Crew did it it was erasing the line, bc hip hop wasn't explicit, there were only a handful of people with explicit lyrics. Ghost doing it now isn't being creative at all. Maybe you just like hearing him describe his dick. Which is cool. To each his own.

Haha, word. I definately back cd's post. There is nothing creative about it at all considering the era where Ghost dropped those verses. It's just lame really. A grown man rapping explicit shit just for the sake of it. 'Wildflower' is possibly my favourite Ghost track. I think it's great. He's ripping on some ho who did him wrong. I can relate to that. But randomly spitting verses of that nature in a song like 'Projects' for example, is just really lame, inappropriate, uncalled-for and pointless.

okay thats cool, I voice my opinion, and get a homo joke thrown at me. But with a comment like that I just have to ask cd, where's your mind at?

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Originally Posted by beautifulrock

okay thats cool, I voice my opinion, and get a homo joke thrown at me. But with a comment like that I just have to ask cd, where's your mind at?

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Did I say anything about being a homo? That's just how you're taking it. You explained how you feel Ghost on Projects is completely artistic and eye opening. I personally think he sounds like a 15 year old plus it doesn't fit the song. So from that I take it you enjoy his rhymes about his dick, bc that's what it was. Doesn't mean you're gay, but I don't understand how you think it's great. So to each his own. Don't see how you got upset about it. It's what you said you like.

Did I ever once mention the song projects? Did I? I don't think so.

and you said "maybe you just like hearing him describe his dick." sounds like a jab to me, but if I misinterpreted your intentions, well who cares anyway? Why would you say that unless you had a couple skeletons in the old closet that needs some air?

micheal Jackson said to tell you guys that you all suck and cilvaringz album will go platinum if he has something to say about it

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Originally Posted by graveyard_shifter

micheal Jackson said to tell you guys that you all suck and cilvaringz album will go platinum if he has something to say about it

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heeeeeeeeeeee heeeeeeeeeee

MJ^^^

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Originally Posted by beautifulrock

Did I ever once mention the song projects? Did I? I don't think so.

and you said "maybe you just like hearing him describe his dick." sounds like a jab to me, but if I misinterpreted your intentions, well who cares anyway? Why would you say that unless you had a couple skeletons in the old closet that needs some air?

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Haha, you are funny. You directly quoted and responded to my comments about Projects......So not only do you love hearing Ghost rhyme about his dick, are overly sensitive that someone might think you're gay, now you're fantasizing about me. Just admit it and release the burden. You'll be fine. There's nothing wrong with it.

MJ will probably love you more

Oh so you do want my beautifulcock? Well I don't swing that way but maybe you can ask jasper whats up? I hear he's into 10 year old boys, which you clearly are. Grow up homophobe. It's 2007.

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Originally Posted by beautifulrock

Oh so you do want my beautifulcock? Well I don't swing that way but maybe you can ask jasper whats up? I hear he's into 10 year old boys, which you clearly are. Grow up homophobe. It's 2007.

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Man, if you wanna talk shit, kid, learn how to. Lackluster at best. Besides you were the one getting upset over the internet bc someone might of made a gay joke at you. So that actually makes you the homophobe doesn't it? Not funny and not bright....you fit in perfectly here....

I'm not upset at all. If you like attacking people you don't even know for voicing opinions contrary to yours that's fine. It really makes you look like a real intelligent person. You are the one who started with me remember?
I in no way was attacking what you said, just voicing an opinion. You deciced to jab at me, cool, whatever. At a staggering 124 posts you must know everything about everyone on here. I'm sorry I even questioned your omnipotence on here. I will leave you now so you can go back to thinking everyone else is wrong and your opinion is the only one that matters.

I STILL cannot understand why some people do not like Fish Scale.

because he didn't do anything new on Fishscale..usually he did

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Originally Posted by *Robbydigital*

Humpty Dumpty fell off a fucking wall and went splat.
What did Ghost fall off?
This is a riddle.

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Ghost fell off the plateau we raised him too. In our minds. We had him on level 8 Super Mario Bros. fighting King Koopa. And he tumbled back to the warpzones of level 1-2.

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Originally Posted by wera

because he didn't do anything new on Fishscale..usually he did

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He did Underwater. The beat just became boring after a bit. Although I did do the collage of the lyrics. The other songs on the album relied heavily on Ghost his story telling and back to the coke dictionary again. Now that was something we left behind. So we thought.


Noel,
Could I be that you grew older. And Ghostface went some other way. So that in that perspectivbe Ghost may still make good hiphop for people who are used to todays standards. We grew up on a different Ghost. With different sounds.

It's weird how noel completely abandons what he brings up to begin with. First he compares Ghost to all these mainstream hip-hop rappers (who go completely nameless until he mentions G-Unit), then gets asked by more than one person to give some examples and then he's all "Man, shit, I don't MEAN JUST LIKE G-Unit, I mean just stuff that comes on the radio." Let's not even forget the fact that, by his own admission, he doesn't listen to the radio (which should null and void his point all together), and then gets called out AGAIN for comparing Ghostface to mainstream rappers and goes all "Man, shit, I hate how you guys twist my words! I don't MEAN all mainstream rappers, just shit that comes on the radio." Rinse, lather, repeat. Furthermore, according to him, the only "relevant" points are those who manage to follow is circular arguments and co-sign his nonsense. I'm all for different opinions, but those co-signing his point of view should at least help him form an argument that isn't so circular in nature. Having an opinion, as an adult, means you can discuss and elaborate on why you feel the way you feel in a reasonable manner. Not everyone has to, or is going to, agree with you, but there is a level of reason to it that can't be denied. The fact he's completely unopen to differing viewpoints makes him sound like that kid in the park that says he's, "King of the Universe." When asked why he feels that way he's all "'Cause I feel like it, my opinion is just as good as yours." O...K.

I'm beginning to think him venting his "opinion" is more than likely just a shock thread that we have all fell for. He says the same things over and over again, and then doesn't back anything HE brings up.

Ironman and Supreme clientele are his best.

IMO More Fish is better than Fishscale...i feel that some songs become boring...(like Shakey Dog) on FS after few listens

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Originally Posted by hide1998

It's weird how noel completely abandons what he brings up to begin with. First he compares Ghost to all these mainstream hip-hop rappers (who go completely nameless until he mentions G-Unit), then gets asked by more than one person to give some examples and then he's all "Man, shit, I don't MEAN JUST LIKE G-Unit, I mean just stuff that comes on the radio." Let's not even forget the fact that, by his own admission, he doesn't listen to the radio (which should null and void his point all together), and then gets called out AGAIN for comparing Ghostface to mainstream rappers and goes all "Man, shit, I hate how you guys twist my words! I don't MEAN all mainstream rappers, just shit that comes on the radio." Rinse, lather, repeat. Furthermore, according to him, the only "relevant" points are those who manage to follow is circular arguments and co-sign his nonsense. I'm all for different opinions, but those co-signing his point of view should at least help him form an argument that isn't so circular in nature. Having an opinion, as an adult, means you can discuss and elaborate on why you feel the way you feel in a reasonable manner. Not everyone has to, or is going to, agree with you, but there is a level of reason to it that can't be denied. The fact he's completely unopen to differing viewpoints makes him sound like that kid in the park that says he's, "King of the Universe." When asked why he feels that way he's all "'Cause I feel like it, my opinion is just as good as yours." O...K.

I'm beginning to think him venting his "opinion" is more than likely just a shock thread that we have all fell for. He says the same things over and over again, and then doesn't back anything HE brings up.

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This time was well spent argumenting your own opinion...

How come everytime I try to read into the pro's for Ghost, all I read is internet rants?

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Noel,

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Could I be that you grew older. And Ghostface went some other way. So that in that perspectivbe Ghost may still make good hiphop for people who are used to todays standards. We grew up on a different Ghost. With different sounds.

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It definitely plays a part in it. Considering I find almost no new hip hop appealing it is undeniable that it plays some part. But seeing how many people seem to feel the same or a similar way to me tells me that it’s also got a lot to do with the music Ghost is putting out.


Hide1998, I’m gonna do something new here and refuse to repeat myself on the commercial/G Unit thing. If you want an explanation for that you can find it in any number of my posts. Consider this though…If you didn’t listen to commercial radio or watch music video shows, would you still hear commercial hip hop in your day to day life? Some people in this thread don’t seem to be able to accept the idea that a discussion can be held speaking in general terms. Do you really think my quoting a few cliché Ghost verses is gonna prove anything? It would be exactly the same as you naming a few Ghost tracks that DON’T have cliché lyrics. It wouldn’t prove a thing. We’re speaking in general terms here and if you don’t like it then find another thread. It’s my thread and I set the intended direction of it, which was to discuss Ghost in general. Yes I could quote some cliché Ghost lyrics. Why don’t I?

• It wouldn’t prove a thing.
• I couldn’t be bothered.
• I’m not trying to convince anybody of anything. Just sharing my observations.
• The only reason I would do it is because a few individuals are demanding it. But those same individuals could and would complain about how it doesn’t prove anything if I did do it. And rightly so too, because it wouldn’t prove anything.
• Digging up lyrics would take effort I’d rather avoid. And why would I be putting that effort in? Because a couple of people on here have asked me to. But I actually don’t give half a shit if these people don’t support my opinions, or think not quoting lyrics invalidates my argument. It just doesn’t bother me. Like I’ve said many times, I was just sharing my observations here and seeing if other people felt similar. I’m not trying to convince anybody of anything.

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The fact he's completely unopen to differing viewpoints

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I’m really not sure what warrants such a suggestion as this.

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Originally Posted by Jet Set

This time was well spent argumenting your own opinion...

How come everytime I try to read into the pro's for Ghost, all I read is internet rants?

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How come everytime I try to read into the negatives for Ghost, all I read is internet rants?

See how simple that was?

Again, in my prior post I specifically mentioned how he (noel) continuously mentioned the same points again and again and again that HE (not other people) brought up to begin with. When asked, in one form or another, to elaborate or give examples of how that was the case, he backs out time and time again.

If that somehow translates to nothing more than an internet rant, then noel's posts are surely worse than that.....

Or, then again, you could be one those people who co-sign everything noel is saying which would make you, as noel himself put, someone with something "relevant" to say.

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Originally Posted by noel411

It definitely plays a part in it. Considering I find almost no new hip hop appealing it is undeniable that it plays some part. But seeing how many people seem to feel the same or a similar way to me tells me that it’s also got a lot to do with the music Ghost is putting out.


Hide1998, I’m gonna do something new here and refuse to repeat myself on the commercial/G Unit thing. If you want an explanation for that you can find it in any number of my posts. Consider this though…If you didn’t listen to commercial radio or watch music video shows, would you still hear commercial hip hop in your day to day life? Some people in this thread don’t seem to be able to accept the idea that a discussion can be held speaking in general terms. Do you really think my quoting a few cliché Ghost verses is gonna prove anything? It would be exactly the same as you naming a few Ghost tracks that DON’T have cliché lyrics. It wouldn’t prove a thing. We’re speaking in general terms here and if you don’t like it then find another thread. It’s my thread and I set the intended direction of it, which was to discuss Ghost in general. Yes I could quote some cliché Ghost lyrics. Why don’t I?

• It wouldn’t prove a thing.
• I couldn’t be bothered.
• I’m not trying to convince anybody of anything. Just sharing my observations.
• The only reason I would do it is because a few individuals are demanding it. But those same individuals could and would complain about how it doesn’t prove anything if I did do it. And rightly so too, because it wouldn’t prove anything.
• Digging up lyrics would take effort I’d rather avoid. And why would I be putting that effort in? Because a couple of people on here have asked me to. But I actually don’t give half a shit if these people don’t support my opinions, or think not quoting lyrics invalidates my argument. It just doesn’t bother me. Like I’ve said many times, I was just sharing my observations here and seeing if other people felt similar. I’m not trying to convince anybody of anything.

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GZA is the greatest MC ever! Why? *sigh* I can't be bothered to explain why, he just is. Elaborating on that with some examples of why I feel the way I do, as an adult, would be pointless. Trying is the first step to failure anyway. No one would agree with me, so what's the point. Don't ask me why, I won't expand on it. I'm just stating my opinion.

Macy Gray is the worst singer ever! Why? *sigh* I can't be bothered to explain why, she just is. Elaborating on that with some examples of why I feel the way I do, as an adult, would be pointless. Trying is the first step to failure anyway. No one would agree with me, so what's the point? Don't ask me why, I won't expand on it. I'm just stating my opinion.

Jimi Hendrix is the greatest guitar player ever! Why? *sigh* I can't be bothered to explain why, he just is. Elaborating on that with some examples of why I feel the way I do, as an adult, would be pointless. Trying is the first step to failure anyway. No one would agree with me, so what's the point. Don't ask me why, I won't expand on it. I'm just stating my opinion.

You know what, I think I'm starting to get noel afterall.

Why do you have to be so fuckin' ridiculous? Are you actually trying to pretend you don't see the absurdity of that post?

Let's go back to my first post. I said Ghost has lost appeal and his last few albums are boring and average. This is my OPINION. There is nothing to back up. Do I have to prove I really have this opinion? Ok, none of his albums since SC has made me want to continue listening to them after the first few listens, and very little he has done on any of those albums has impressed me. Can you accept that? Or are you gonna continue to come up with absurd bullshit about how I'm not allowed to say things like that?

The other thing I said is that a lot of his lyrics on recent albums are the same as what other commercial artists are writing. Hmmm, ok, this is more than just an opinion, so how can I prove it? Well, let's see. I could just find lyrics from a handful of Ghost songs and also a few songs by other commercial artists, of a similar nature, and post them here for comparison. But wait a second, anybody with the slightest bit of sense can see that that really wouldn't prove a thing. I'm sure even an utter fucking idiot would realise that you could do the same thing with almost any artist. Damn, there goes that idea. I guess I'd really have to dig up a solid portion of Ghost's recent lyrics and find a good many tracks from several commercial artists with similar lyrics to actually prove my point. But wait a second, I really couldn't be fucked doing that just to make a point to a couple of guys who can't accept the fact that someone doesn't like Ghost. After all, I was only making an observation to see how other people felt about it. I never considered that anybody would be so troubled by it that they would hassle me with bullshit non-stop, forcing me to repeat myself time and time again.

Do you understand my logic?

nobody i mean nobody writes like ghost, if u can prove that i'd like to see it. 50 cent couldn't even come close to writing something as profoundly absurd as underwater.

Sons is entitled to his opinion. Evendough its wrong, like gay man pregnant with twins. Sure Ghost has taken this though coke-selling-don-guy-who-still-cooks-for-his-lady-friend a bit to the extreme. But that's his shit. And within those lines, ain't nobody doin' like Ghost.

The rap game is filled, I repeat FILLED with coke rappers who seem to just waked up in a Scarface seqeunce while Cuban Linx is playing in the back. Even Busta is doin' it, goddamned! Why is Ghost still relevant? Why is even needed then.. The originality of coming off fresh in tired evironment.

And am not even goin' start about tracks like Whip You With A Strap & Underwater.

Still, I kinda agree with dude. I think that anything after Fishscale (am goin to ignore More Fish, sue me) would cost Ghost some props if he get on the same ol horse again.

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Originally Posted by noel411

Why do you have to be so fuckin' ridiculous? Are you actually trying to pretend you don't see the absurdity of that post?

Let's go back to my first post. I said Ghost has lost appeal and his last few albums are boring and average. This is my OPINION. There is nothing to back up. Do I have to prove I really have this opinion? Ok, none of his albums since SC has made me want to continue listening to them after the first few listens, and very little he has done on any of those albums has impressed me. Can you accept that? Or are you gonna continue to come up with absurd bullshit about how I'm not allowed to say things like that?

The other thing I said is that a lot of his lyrics on recent albums are the same as what other commercial artists are writing. Hmmm, ok, this is more than just an opinion, so how can I prove it? Well, let's see. I could just find lyrics from a handful of Ghost songs and also a few songs by other commercial artists, of a similar nature, and post them here for comparison. But wait a second, anybody with the slightest bit of sense can see that that really wouldn't prove a thing. I'm sure even an utter fucking idiot would realise that you could do the same thing with almost any artist. Damn, there goes that idea. I guess I'd really have to dig up a solid portion of Ghost's recent lyrics and find a good many tracks from several commercial artists with similar lyrics to actually prove my point. But wait a second, I really couldn't be fucked doing that just to make a point to a couple of guys who can't accept the fact that someone doesn't like Ghost. After all, I was only making an observation to see how other people felt about it. I never considered that anybody would be so troubled by it that they would hassle me with bullshit non-stop, forcing me to repeat myself time and time again.

Do you understand my logic?

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So basically you shouldn't throw out pointless phrases like "he's just like other commercial/mainstream rappers" if you can't follow it up when someone asks a simple "Can you give me an example?"

Remember, YOU were the one who threw that statement out there, no one coaxed it out of you.

You either feel Ghost, or you don't. So what's the point of adding complete nonsense as of a way, somehow, validating your point of view?

That's the point that, somehow, you keep not getting. And that was the only point I was questioning (Well that, and your whole "no one else said anything relevant that didn't go with what I'm saying" statement).

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Originally Posted by hide1998

So basically you shouldn't throw out pointless phrases like "he's just like other commercial/mainstream rappers" if you can't follow it up when someone asks a simple "Can you give me an example?"

Remember, YOU were the one who threw that statement out there, no one coaxed it out of you.

You either feel Ghost, or you don't. So what's the point of adding complete nonsense as of a way, somehow, validating your point of view?

That's the point that, somehow, you keep not getting. And that was the only point I was questioning (Well that, and your whole "no one else said anything relevant that didn't go with what I'm saying" statement).

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You know, you are getting quite ridiculous. You seem to be the one not getting it, or not wanting to get it bc Noel has the audacity to be tired of Ghost's style at the moment. And I really don't want to defend Noel bc he's a complete ass, but you seem to be thinking that his posts are somewhat lacking while yours have some substance, which is far from reality.

He stated his opinion. He also told the situation of him reading the lyrics to "Ghostface" without the hook and not knowing who it was and thinking it was some GUnit, Dipset, insert all the carbon copy rappers here. Which is true. If you listen to some of Ghost's newer lyrics, they are dumbed down. Noel stated he doesnt like it and thinks it's bullshit. That's simple enough to understand for most people. You keep saying he hasn't given examples and ask for more. You don't need more, you should get the jist already. It's not a mistake on his explaining, it's your understanding or not wanting to understand what he said.

In addition to this ,Ghost in interviews has said himself he has and is dumbing down his lyrics for the most part. So the man himself says so. Now you can still thoroughly enjoy his stuff, that's fine. But the fact is he HAS dumbed down his music and tried to be more radio friendly. A lot of Wu Fans wont be into it. They have a valid point.

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Originally Posted by cd

You know, you are getting quite ridiculous. You seem to be the one not getting it, or not wanting to get it bc Noel has the audacity to be tired of Ghost's style at the moment. And I really don't want to defend Noel bc he's a complete ass, but you seem to be thinking that his posts are somewhat lacking while yours have some substance, which is far from reality.

He stated his opinion. He also told the situation of him reading the lyrics to "Ghostface" without the hook and not knowing who it was and thinking it was some GUnit, Dipset, insert all the carbon copy rappers here. Which is true. If you listen to some of Ghost's newer lyrics, they are dumbed down. Noel stated he doesnt like it and thinks it's bullshit. That's simple enough to understand for most people. You keep saying he hasn't given examples and ask for more. You don't need more, you should get the jist already. It's not a mistake on his explaining, it's your understanding or not wanting to understand what he said.

In addition to this ,Ghost in interviews has said himself he has and is dumbing down his lyrics for the most part. So the man himself says so. Now you can still thoroughly enjoy his stuff, that's fine. But the fact is he HAS dumbed down his music and tried to be more radio friendly. A lot of Wu Fans wont be into it. They have a valid point.

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Did you not read my posts, and his posts?

He bluntly stated (more than once in fact), that Ghostface is like all the other mainstream/commercial hip-hop (the example he pointed out was G-Unit). He was then asked (not JUST by me, but we'll pretend I was the only one to simplify things) to give an example. He (noel) backs out, and oddly enough says he doesn't listen to the radio. Then goes BACK to saying Ghostface is just like what he hears on the radio (every other commercial/mainstream artists). He's AGAIN asked to give an example what he means and he (noel) gets all antsy about a point HE brought up that HE can't backup.

THAT was the point I was attacking (well...and the whole "no one has anything of substance that didn't go along with what I was already saying" reference).

I'm not missing a thing as far as the very specific point I was aiming for with noel.

You can go back and read how he couldn't backup that specific point (again, I was NOT the only person who asked him to give examples), and how he couldn't back it up at all.

Interestingly enough, in his very last post he openly admits that he's not going to even try to back up that point.

That's the problem when you add unnecessary dirt just for the sake of making your opinion (he doesn't feel Ghostface now like he did during the Ironman days...fair enough) look stronger. When questioned about it, you can't back it up, and end up having to just back out of it altogether.

Notice how in none of my posts did I ever say, "noel you're wrong for feeling Ghostface more during his Ironman days than how is is these days."

You think noel's a jerk. I, personally, don't know enough about him on this board. But I do find it interesting how brings up things that he can't back out like the whole Ghostface/G-Unit thing *shrugs*

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Originally Posted by hide1998

Did you not read my posts, and his posts?

He bluntly stated (more than once in fact), that Ghostface is like all the other mainstream/commercial hip-hop (the example he pointed out was G-Unit). He was then asked (not JUST by me, but we'll pretend I was the only one to simplify things) to give an example. He (noel) backs out, and oddly enough says he doesn't listen to the radio. Then goes BACK to saying Ghostface is just like what he hears on the radio (every other commercial/mainstream artists). He's AGAIN asked to give an example what he means and he (noel) gets all antsy about a point HE brought up that HE can't backup.

THAT was the point I was attacking (well...and the whole "no one has anything of substance that didn't go along with what I was already saying" reference).

I'm not missing a thing as far as the very specific point I was aiming for with noel.

You can go back and read how he couldn't backup that specific point (again, I was NOT the only person who asked him to give examples), and how he couldn't back it up at all.

Interestingly enough, in his very last post he openly admits that he's not going to even try to back up that point.

That's the problem when you add unnecessary dirt just for the sake of making your opinion (he doesn't feel Ghostface now like he did during the Ironman days...fair enough) look stronger. When questioned about it, you can't back it up, and end up having to just back out of it altogether.

Notice how in none of my posts did I ever say, "noel you're wrong for feeling Ghostface more during his Ironman days than how is is these days."

You think noel's a jerk. I, personally, don't know enough about him on this board. But I do find it interesting how brings up things that he can't back out like the whole Ghostface/G-Unit thing *shrugs*

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Wow, you really don't want to read or understand what anyone is saying do you? You just want to try and force your point which is completely off, thinking if you rant long enough, it will be true.

He DID give you guys a very specific example. You choose to ignore it and then keep repeatedly asking for more examples. If you're going to ignore the one, why should he bother with digging up more? You are trying to twist things and it's tranparent and pointless. He also explained to you about the radio comment.

Just bc one doesn't listen to the radio, doesn't mean that you don't end up hearing it. He explained this to you. He doesn't listen to the radio himself but ends up hearing it when other people play it. This is another point he explained but you again choose to ignore what you want and try to use it as a point against him. This further twisting makes you look either dishonest or just unable to comprehend what he is saying. I never listen to the radio myself, but end up hearing it often, not a difficult concept to grasp.

And once again, bc you choose to ignore it also, GHOST HIMSELF has said he has dumbed down his rhymes. Another fact that is the basis for what Noel has stated, and you ignore. He has given an example, you just feel differently which is fine, it's all taste and opinion, but to say he hasn't backed anything up at all is bordering on delusional.