peace zooraka, you raised some good points
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peace zooraka, you raised some good points
all these people that say constantine and others manipulated the bible and whatever...and created a 'Jesus conspiracy"...for what? what benefit did it do really do? You assume Constantine added and took things away from the bible...why do you assume the worst? he never said anything like "worship your emporer" or anything like that...the teachings of Christ and the new testament are pure...something all humans should strive to follow...there is no evil or barbarism in it, unlike some other 'holy books'.
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Originally Posted by sarr
TRUTH and FACT....
all constantine did was preside over the council of nicean....where two competing doctrines of faith where vying for adoption by the church ... but these doctrines where drafted by christian theologians and scholors... NOT CONSTANTINE ..... all constantine did was just hosted the meeting he had absouloutly nothing to do with what was written... so this claim that constantine somehow changed christianity is B.S... dude just hosted a meeting!
peace sarr
peace
"you don't ask these questions because you want to learn anything, you ask because you're looking for fault in the answers provided so that you can tell yourself the religion you follow is better. I could respond to your inquiries but that would be a pointless waste of time"
I completely aggree. This thread is for the sake of arguing and usually as a rule when people try to argue with me I dont respond (if they wish to learn something about Islam I am happy to discuss though)
but I would just liek to give my 2 cents as a new muslim. I am english and both my parents are agnostic but I dont live with them. I moved away because I have a big past in my hometown and am here to get an education and make something of myself and I reverted to Islam in febuary of this year after many years of predjudice I visited morocoo, saw islam for what it really is and alhamdulila I fell in love wit the religion.
Enough about me. I have come across a gossipel called the gossipel of barnabus. This contradicts teh christian view and backs up the Islamic viewpoint and this gossipel was stolen from the vatican. As far as I understand it, the islamic belief is that Judas was crucified in Isa's US (arabic for Jesus) place. This was Allah wrath on Judas for handing Isa US to the authority's. Isa was not the son of God but a very holy prophet, and a great man and his folowers are to be respected to by muslims. The world is unfortunately heavily influenced by the media (me included until recently when I stopped buying newspapers) so what you understand about islam is heavily misguided. FOr instance, do you know 7 muslims died at the hands of al q'eda yesterday? Everyone thinks muslim = terrorist so tell me if we're all terrorist then why are th suicide bombers targetting muslims? I'll be happy to answer any questions and I respect all religions as requested by Allah in the holy Qu'ran but anyone acts hostile towards me Ill just ignore you because a conversation like this can only happen if people have good intentions and not ignorantly putting my religion down as if this is some sort of football match and your on the opposing team. We're all human beings remeber, we're all on the same team. Peace!
and prof zooruka what exactly makes you qualified to interpret the qu'ran? The qu'ran teaches us to defend our religion, and these sorts of surah's are specific to war, christians and Jews have dhimmi status in Islam which means PROTECTED as long as they pay a tax for not being muslim they are free to walk muslim lands freely (unlike in christian lands where teh muslims would be slayed on teh spot, and taxes were much higher than that of islamic countries so dhimmi's actually paid LESS tax)
you cant just quote one verse from teh qu'ran because the qu'ran has to be taken in its entirety. I am muslim, I have read the qu'ran, I am satisified taht it doesn't teach me to go out and slaughetr innocent people so its a bit of a joke to hear someone who clearly knows nothing about Islam tell everyone what a surah means. If it really did teach us to kill, the world would have nearly 2billion suicide bombers, we could wipe out teh whole population of the planet with that many people
dawood, would relligion were you previously? what ethnicity are you if you dont mind me asking
I was roman catholic before and I am completely white and both parents are natural british. My grandfather fought in WW2 and my grandmother was in the land army. My family has lived in England for many generations so Im as english as you can get and I have converted 100% because of personal choice after great thought on which choices Id like to make in life alhamdulila
Welcome to the forums dawood. Alhamdulilah to your reversion and may you find happiness.
what has been demonstrated in this thread is the inability to convey a message of hatred towards a specific religion.
people choose carefully, aspects out of context from religious texts or sayings, which will overshadow the inherently peaceful nature of a religion.
note that my last "more articulate" post was not addressed by "prof zooroka". it just proves his inability to cope with higher level information that his brain cannot understand.
interesting...so dont you think maybe, just maybe, that if God wanted you to be born Muslim, you woulda been born one?Quote:
Originally Posted by dawood
or maybe..even the Quran says Christians and Jews (good ones) will goto heaven....so if you stayed a Christian and a good one..your chances of going to heaven were 100% (according to both your birth religion and your new religion)...but now, theoritically, you've cut your chances down to 50% assuming your a good muslim..because by Christian teachings, Rejecting Jesus Christ, means you wont be allowed into heaven.
no that is the reality of islam that I have posted..... whatever is said to be so called peacefull teachings in islam, is cancled out but the verses that call for other people to be slaughtered and not to mention the way muhummad conducted himself in general " so I am basing my opinion on the general over view of islam" not just picking and choosing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Prince Rai
the bible is not selected text for the conviniance of promoting a cetain message... the message was always there and was written in the same spirit buy the individuals who wrote them.... thats why it makes perfect sense (they where of one mind )...the bible was just organised by the church.... and makes more sense in chronological order that the koran " I mean in the koran you have one verse saying love jews...next you have a verse saying all jews will be killed by muslims on the last day, what is that !( one minute you have muhummad saying "GOD" told him to respect the jews , next you have GOD saying muslims will kill the jews...I mean has GOD lost it or what....and what is astonishing is mhummad is claiming, it is the same god who created judaism ...who now says muslims will kill his very own chosen people)... I mean honestly, muhummad makes GOD look mad...the bible`s message doesnt chop and change its views like the koran... it flows and is on song every step of the way.... all messages and proclomations are one ( and thats somthing that cant be or was organised by the church) because thats the way the text where written all writers agree on the directions of there teachings (and that direction is based on what christ said).... so the bible can most certainly be read as a collective peice...yet the koran is jibberish sayings that are all over the place and absouloutly dont flow or make cohesive sense and when read as a collective peice show what rubbish it really is and probably leave the reader more confused than when they started... wich proves muhummad was making it up as he went along.( the contridictions in the koran prove it)Quote:
Originally Posted by Prince Rai
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prince Rai
islam means conquring the world !!!! the god of islam is not the same GOD as that of christianity or judaism ...what because muhummad said so hahahaha lmao...you know its not the same GOD because of the message...islam denies the crucifixtion wich is central to christian beleif as taught by JESUS himself.... muhummad said jews will be sluaghtered on the last day....why would the same GOD who created judaism and in the bible call them his chosen people ...now be prophesysing that on the last day muslims will slaughter and kill jews.....that proves its not the same GOD ...sorry its all B.S
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Originally Posted by Prince Rai
does the following sura answer your question
Bukhari (52:177) - Allah's Apostle said, "The Hour will not be established until you fight with the Jews, and the stone behind which a Jew will be hiding will say. "O Muslim! There is a Jew hiding behind me, so kill him."
jews and christians have to pay taxes for not being muslims... I dont see christians or jews saying anything like this today in france england or america...muslims are allowed to live freely and have the same rights as everyone else... and I dont see christ saying if muslims or jews come under your controlle make them pay something because they arent christian... islam is a supremist religion and doesnt treat everyone and or the other so called true religions of GOD equally NO....it has the motto of making them know they are inferior because they arent muslims...... that is why they should pay taxes...( i mean what bulshit is that and muhummad says they are all people of the book who should be respected) my ass ...so to say that muslims offered protection to jews and christians is not true..there are conditions......christians and jews dont put those conditions on the freedom of muslims and what if christians and jews dont pay taxes...they will probably be killed....so islam doesnt protect the other religions....they impose sanctions on them to have that freedom its not given freely.Quote:
Originally Posted by Prince Rai
no they are following the example and teachings of muhummad...and anyway the teachings and examples are there to exploit....you cant do that with the teachings or examples of christ because they arent there!.Quote:
Originally Posted by Prince Rai
yes maybe bush and blair said that ... but the above picture dont come from the examples teachings of the founder of the religion unlike islam!Quote:
Originally Posted by Prince Rai
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prince Rai
No im not into bashing other faiths for the sake of bashing them...i mean i dont bash judaism....why because its a religion of GOD....but I reject islam because its false and JESUS said to us " BE CAREFUL AND DONT LET ANYONE FOOL YOU MANY FALSE PROPHETS WILL ARISE AND CLAIM TO SPEAK FOR ME AND WILL FOOL MANY PEOPLE" and he also said to add to that "YOU WILL NO A FALSE PROPHET BY WHAT THEY DO" and from what I have read and heard I know what muhummad did...and I dont care how much people try to sugar coat islam as a peaceful religion its overal essence is evil and violent and false why because it contridicts everything that was taught by GOD before.
peace prince rai
peace
You're not quoting the Quran if anything starts with Bukhari, I figure I need to let you in on that since you don't actually own the Quran and have never read it. That's obvious by all your ridiculous post where you just keep repeating yourself.Quote:
why because it contridicts everything that was taught by GOD before.
Now tell me, in direct relation to your quote how this verse goes against the teaching of either the Old or New Testament:
If any do deeds of righteousness, be they male or female, and have faith they will enter Heaven and not the least injustice will be done to them.
???? Don't dance around the subject either, address this Surah directly
muhummad stole those ideas from judism and christianity....off course if someone was attempting to establish a legitiment religion they would have to say things like that....the bible says even the devil can pose as an angle of light...but you have to take the koran as a whole... and as a whole it is a false violent religion who seeks to destroy the teachings of judaism and of christianity and replace them with islam....I mean lets be realistic here going from the teachings of christ ( turn thr other cheek) to the teachings of muhummad ( do jihad a nd kill people who dont believe in GOD) is taking a infinant amount of steps backwards.Quote:
Originally Posted by Visions Unseen
peace
exactly you didn't address what I posted at all.Quote:
Originally Posted by prof zooruka
violent false religion blah blah blah
be honest. You've never picked up the Quran and really read it have you?
Every verse you've ever posted was you copying n' pasting from a Christian site begging to be painted as the persecuted, true or untrue?
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Originally Posted by Visions Unseen
the fact that those verses are even there in the quran tells me its false even if I dont believe in religion my own common sense tells me they are wrong...you cant teach peace and violent at the same time...its not possible....christ taught nothing but peace...thats why his teaching are true...muhummad taught peace and to use violence when you dont get your own way...now tell me wich one of the to would sound like it came from GOD.
how bout you answer a direct question for once. There was atleast two in that last post of mine. Be a good Christian and have some respect for those that have extended you the same.Quote:
Originally Posted by prof zooruka