http://www.forbes.com/sites/zackomal...-secret-album/
Congrats Tarik and best of luck on the sale!
PEACE
http://www.forbes.com/sites/zackomal...-secret-album/
Congrats Tarik and best of luck on the sale!
PEACE
Thanks. Not online sale thougg. It's a private sale.
Sorry, tried to alter title. Online auction house site Paddle-8
Mods can u update?
Only newsworthy if I can actually purchase this album and listen to it when I choose. Which I assume is still unlikely. Just my opinion. Peace
That says they haven't got nearly what they were asking, because it just would have sold already. Anyone that would pay millions for an album is really foolish with their money- as most people don't even pay for their music and just get it online. Most songs by any artist just sound the same anyhow, so rarely does an artist have something so new , you just have to have it, especially from an group that at this point is an "oldies" group. If their commercial album did not do well, why would anyone pay millions-shit, you could get them to perform live at your house for that money and make them play all those songs per the performance contract. Bet you they would not turn it down and you could probably pay half that album price :) Just saying
I fall in the don't give a fuck category until I can hear it.
It's just ego and greed, the album was hyped up massively. all news and media outlets were talking about it.Quote:
Originally Posted by sinfullycute
The offers of $4-$5M were not enough? apparently not..
I bet once Rza was involved with this album he wanted what? 70-75% of the sale price?
All in the name of art as well.. yes... ofcourse it was..
The greed out did the hype.
Unlucky Ringz.
After the release of ABT I wouldn't want to hear this anywayQuote:
Originally Posted by RUSHING PLATYPUS
The first thing I have a problem with is how shady this all is.
^ This is a lie anyone on here knows this album was not recorded by the Wu-Tang Clan has a Wu-Tang album before last year it was a Cilvaringz album and you even admitted that only a handful of them recorded in front of you instead most emailed you there verses and on top of that you paid them to spit verses like how any DJ or producer would on his album.Quote:
Nearly a year ago, the Wu-Tang Clan shocked the music world with an announcement too bizarre for fiction: the hip-hop collective had recorded a secret double album dubbed The Wu –
Once Upon A Time In Shaolin
If it was a Clan album they would not get paid per verse and while on that matter I bet they did not agree to what your doing now and just thought it was your album before realising you are now asking millions of dollars for an album that without them would not be a blip on the radar of Wu fans let alone Forbes and the 1%.
The fact is 50% of people think this is a collection of unreleased Wu tracks from the Wu-Forever era and the others think its a real Wu-Tang record this is false advertisement and now makes alot more sense to why you deleted post's and threads about this album.
And damn right he should he build the Wu without him no one except Gza would have an album.Quote:
Originally Posted by Origin™
I bet once Rza was involved with this album he wanted what? 70-75% of the sale price?
Lets face facts if you have ridden the coat tails of a group and eat from there table when you have done nothing in the sense of building the foundations of Wu-Tang let alone contributed to the past 20 years in fact name one thing other then this album that has made any sort of impact in the clan's history...
In fact name one Wu-Tang Clan album you have had any involvement in.
And to even talk about taking hip hop and placing it in to the elite world like its a good thing is an absolute joke, you and the Rza (has he should of known better) are the biggest SELL OUTS in hip hop history. the corporate powers that be diluted it, packaged and sold it to the masses.
You have sold it to the 1%
Quote:
Originally Posted by zu fam
Totally agree my man.. the way it's all been handled is some serious snake shit. for lack of a better phrase it's some jew shit.
Complete slap in the face to what HipHop culture is.
But we got to remember it's in the name of "art"
It's just some old white man jew shit plain and simple.
Why?Quote:
Originally Posted by The Hound
what is everybody really getting worked up about? it was going to be a double album sold in the regular way until Ringz realized people were going to download the shit out of it as they did with so many other wu releases. and it would have hardly been a blimp on the radar in terms of wu history that way. so the 1 copy album thing makes a lot of sense to me, still, as a financial statement and definitely as an artistic statement. it still makes sense to me how this elevates an album to a unique piece of art and how it can get some people to start thinking about music as an art form differently.
I get how many people are disappointed because they closely followed up on the creation of this album in a thread on this site, especially with the long wait (mixing and mastering process in particular) but maybe we should consider that an artist can do as he pleases with his work and also that he is allowed to change his mind about things. if Ghostface wants to release his next album as lyrics printed on hot air balloons on their way to the Fijis then so be it.
same with the boombotix thing. I might not be overly enthusiastic about the boombotix concept, but if that's how RZA wants to release some of his own production work then so be it - cuz it's his music. artists should control the market, not fans.
maybe somewhere down the line because of things like kickstarter some of us started thinking that we as fans can make things happen the way we want them to. and sometimes it works like that - fortunately - but it doesn't always work like that.
part of this reminds me of what art vandelay stated in a thread yesterday about odb material on a new boombotix thingy, all of this wouldn't happen if fans massively bought the music they enjoyed. and yeah, i download shit too and if I like it I'll buy it (next to a few automatic first day purchases) but I don't go bitching about how artists should do this or that when they release their own product.
also reminds me of what 9th wonder said about the whole iggy azalea / banks beef - invest in music you like instead of bitching about music you don't like. like, actually paying for music. and yeah, you can't buy this particular body of music, but shit happens. it's like people asking about getting that Warcloud Alcatraz album in another thread. if people don't want to share it (I don't have it), then so be it. just accept you can't always get what you want.
then there's also this carefully concealed jealousy thing. cuz a lot of money is involved some people are automatically gonna hate. I bet if someone on the forum won the lottery big time there'd be a lot of hate towards that guy too.
I'd understand all of this better if there were only like five records in the whole wu discography but most of us have piles upon piles of releases. let's keep it real, we all have lots of wu fam albums we haven't listened to in months, maybe years, maybe just enjoy some albums we already have and wait for the next few to come out. none of these cats have retired, plenty more music coming in the next few years.
If I could believe it was actually to benefit the culture I'd agree with you.. this shit was getting offers for $5m my dude.. 5 million...Quote:
Originally Posted by 5th state
Rings knows he's sat on the crown jewels of Wutang music.. even more so now ABT has released it's it pretty obvious Rza cannot deliver a Wu album the fans actually want.
I like Ringz, he's a good dude, the man has put in work, so don't take my view on this shit as an attack on him. I just personally think Rza being involved in this shit was a bad mistake.
All the intereviews I seen involving this album all about Rza, how this new Rza album going to be incredible, How Rza forged Ringz from the basic elements of the earth. hahaha
Simple fact is Ringz can supply the people with the shit they want Rza to go back to creating.
Wu as a group are done now, 2 flops in 14 years..
Thankfully Ghost and Rae keeping the legacy going.
The only thing that can save Wu as a group is in a golden box in the middle of the desert, locked away haha
At the end of the day though I guess it's a pointless argument, nothing anybody says will have any influence on how any of it plays it.
I think 5th State got close to the best solution here when he mentioned kickstarter. If Ringz and RZA are worried about people pirating their music and not making enough money off it, why don't they just put it up on kickstarter and wait until they get "x" amount of dollars for it then release it?
That way the fans that are able to pay for it get it, the artists get their money, and whoever wants to pirate can probably still do so. It seems like a win-win-win
after ABT negotiations of selling this album to a single person would have crashed and burned. lol nobody paying for wu tang music they can't hear first especially after their last release had miracle on it. I'll assume whoever bought this didn't listen to ABT
Brother Origin, I respect the core sense of disapproval you have with this idea. Matter of fact, if I was in your place I'd probably feel the same. First thing I'd say though is the racism thing is not cool.
As for this project, there will be a more in depth interview this month explaining in the clearest sense our motivations and goals we would like to achieve. And probably you'll still might not support it and that's cool. I have explained many times the variety of reasons of why we chose to do this and I'm not going to keep repeating it. Whoever's finds it interesting, great. Whomever doesn't, that's really fine.
Only thing that's really childish are these negative "I want you to fail for whatever reason" toned posts. Discuss it intelligently or just reject it in an adult fashion, all that trolling is childish.
In the end. I find it fucking amazing how a fellow The DSC brother releasing this thing in any form, with The RZA. Peace!
I hope your not talking about my post has I dont want you to fail in fact I dont care of the outcome but all my points are valid!
in fact I respect that music is art but they way your doing it the shady aspects of it all these are serious matters
So no museum tour?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seanuz
^ this should've been the plan from jumpstreet.
I like how the Forbes guy asked RZA about the album alienating fans. But once again, RZA goes on to bring up making ABT as a consolation prize for fans, an album which is damn near universally panned, by fans and critics alike (hell, the Clan themselves weren't for that album). For him to STILL bring up ABT as being for the fans, after all the bad press, just continues to show how detached he is from his fan base. Plain and simple, OUTIS is THE album that fans wanted, and yes, (after many years of support, from the classics to the disappointments) deserved.
hip-hop is dead anyway. thank East Coast USA for the late 80s and 90s, the rest of it can suck a dick
ABT was always the album they didn't give a fuck about that was given to the fans to shut us up and say "hey shut up we gave you an album"Quote:
Originally Posted by TheWuCepticon
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Hound
^ Exactly
:beer:From the snippets and tracklist was gonna be dope; would be hard to be worseQuote:
Originally Posted by The Hound
"consumers have practically re-classified the act of paying for music as philanthropy"
a lot of truth to that statement
"The winning bidder will get to do whatever with the 31-track album -- lend it to a museum, place it in a personal collection, release it online for free, melt it for scrap, whatever -- and if RZA was telling the truth when he said the group had received a $5 million offer for it, then the album will probably fetch a similar amount, possibly more, at auction."
Hopefully the buyer releases it to us the people who been waiting long for this
Phoenix new times represent! I live in Phoenix. Cool shit, great articleQuote:
Originally Posted by Cilvaringz
Ringz, Once this LP has been sold and locked away in somebodies vault to appreciate in value over the next millennium.
Do You have any plans on releasing new material?
We need some Wu music that sounds legit.. I can't be listening to that Rza produced sparkly bullshit no more.
Rza just cannot do Wu music no more, he's ascended to another realm, one that is not dusty and raw.
I ain't interested in no white sparkly cloud happy production shit for Wu music..
RZA is capable of doing pretty much anything, it's just a matter of choices.
As for me, this album has been intense. So I will probably take some time off, but I would like to do a Rae & Ghost album together. Even got a title for it already, but that would be like a final thing I think. We'll see, time will tell.
If the album gets to $500k at auction, what's plan B
The Shaolin business model is great if you are a well known established artist. I can't really see it crossing over or being adapted by upcoming indie artists.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cilvaringz
Thanks for the warning, we'll learn not to get hyped up for that one this time LOL
I have to say that the notion that this album will be a return to music being art is about as pretentious as it gets. A Lou Reed album, a Cormac Mcarthy novel, a Stanley Kubrick film, these things aren't art because they're mass produced?
The conversation about this album has been mainly about its delivery system, but what isn't getting talked about is the artistic merit of the music itself. Without that conversation this whole thing sounds like a gimmick to make money.
No disrespect Ringz, I've always thought this was an intriguing idea, especially the museum tour, but all this talk about 'returning music to art' sounds like an after-the-fact justification, especially since no one will be able to judge the artistic merit of the music alone.
^best point I have read since this album was conceived
Almost thinking out loud here - but if I bought it I think I'd release it via mp3 to the world.
I'd still have the ONLY original copy [and I'd go a long way to get that verified down tight]. It's got the potential to be classic Wu and if it's good it will garner a buzz. and like, I'd have the ONLY copy!!
Otherwise, wouldn't owning this be a bit like owning the Mona Lisa and not letting anyone ever see it?
I pretty much agree.Quote:
Originally Posted by Punch
"Cilvaringz...explained that Wu-Tang wanted to reverse the devaluation of music and help it regain the fine art status it enjoyed during the Renaissance."
The problem with this comparison is that you could not purchase recorded music during the Renaissance, so the value of composed music was monetized through live performance, which it still is today.
If an established artist of the Renaissance period would have held a composition up for auction...let's say they auctioned a single, private performance of the piece...it would certainly pique the interest of many affluent people, but the final price for the private concert would not be an indication of the composition's artistic merit. The composition would not become better or worse depending on how much somebody pays, especially when there are so many variables involved in determining how much one pays.
While art is truly in the eye (or ear) of the beholder, to be considered "art" on a large level requires a consensus among the masses. Let's take the Mona Lisa or statue of David...countless people from all walks of life from around the globe have seen and studied these pieces. Some have seen the one-of-a-kind original pieces and others have seen replicas or photos. Regardless of medium, the artistic relevance is dictated by mass evaluation and consensus among those masses. Note I did not reference sale(s) volume or revenue.
I mention this bc the same holds true for recorded music. The one-of-a-kind original is, for all intents and purposes, the Master copy. The compositions on this master can be distributed through a variety of mediums...compact disc, cassette, vinyl record, a flashdrive, digital streaming, digital download, as a score to a film, in a Boombotix speaker, etc. There may even be a variety of limited editions among these distribution formats. For example, there may be a version limited to 1,000 units that bundles together a compact disc, vinyl record and bound lyric book. Perhaps there's even a more limited version of this bundle - restricted to a single copy - that includes the actual handwritten lyrics rather than a facsimile! That one will be much more sought after and more valuable than the run of 1,000 units, but it's no more artistic. This is because the value of each distribution format will be determined through supply and demand.
The value of art does not rest in its distribution format and cannot be determined by such a limited segment of the population with no "credentials" other than wealth. Artistic merit is derived from a consensus of critical acclaim by peers, professionals and common people alike.
The value of the medium used to distribute the art may be determined by supply and demand in conjunction with the artistic relevance noted above.
At the end of the day, what Cilvaringz and RZA have produced here looks to be an exquisite housing for a compact disc that features (mostly) unheard sound recordings. Its market value will be determined among a market extremely limited in scope based upon some of the following variables:
- Wu-Tang fan and collector that simply can't live without it
- Makes a great conversation piece in the home
- Own something nobody else has
- Invest in the speculative secondhand value of the piece in the future
If someone pays $1 Billion and never lets anyone hear it or someone pays $1 and lets everyone hear it, it does not become any more or less an artistic masterpiece bc that's not tied to volume or revenue.
Also, when I read that the buyer can do whatever they want with it, including distributing it online for free, that really validated what I'm saying. The ART (good or bad) is the recorded music and it doesn't matter what format it's on or how limited it is.
Personally, I love the idea of this one-of-a-kind item, even if I hate that I won't be the one to own it! But all the talk of devaluation of music and restoration of status as it pertains to this release is either misguided or smart marketing.
The artistic value of the music will for some people be a very personal experience, while as a whole will depend on mass consensus of its merit. The commercial value of the formats featuring the recorded music CAN be devalued in several ways. The commercial value of the recorded music itself can be monetized through sales, live performance, licensing, etc., even if some of the sales suffer compared to what they once were.
Bottom line though, the commercial endeavor of selling a single unit of OUATIS has little (or nothing) do with the artistic merit of OUATIS.
only ppl unlucky are fans who were led to believe we'd get this album for like yearsQuote:
Originally Posted by Origin™
and then a cash grab ended that
hopefully for whoever profits it gets a nice sale price
only thing unlucky for ringz is he may have blown a chance at universal recognition as a wu element for a paycheck