25th anniversary of ODB's 2nd album! SUUUUUUUUU 💥👐🏽💥
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25th anniversary of ODB's 2nd album! SUUUUUUUUU 💥👐🏽💥
https://youtube.com/playlist?list=OL...Za5kbef-fFwguA
One of the most underrated Wu-albums ever. Way ahead of its time.
I like it way better than his 1st album. Definitely the best solo album from the 2nd wave with Supreme Clientele.
This, and Beneath The Surface got the most spins from me as far as 2nd solo albums go.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam the Seed
My favorite song off this album, Dirty isn’t even on. That Getting High track….it’s brilliant.
.Quote:
DIRTY STORIES
The lowdown on the making of Ol' Dirty b*stard's masterpiece
BEING THE WU-TANG CLAN'S RESIDENT wildman isn't an easy job, but Ol' Dirty b*stard fulfills the role with gusto and then some: Thanks to his tabloid shenanigans, the controversial MC has racked up more arrest records than musical ones. In the past two years alone, he's been arrested for shoplifting, for making terrorist threats at L.A.'s House of Blues, for wearing illegal body armor and for possessing crack cocaine. With true ODB bad luck, just a month before the release of N***a Please, his second solo album, he was sent to rehab for a lengthy stint. Still, he left behind one of the strangest, funniest, funkiest, most compelling albums of 1999. Below, the behind-the-scenes story of the making of ODB's masterpiece.
RZA, producer and Wu-Tang mastermind: "It took a while for N***a Please to happen. The main struggle was having Dirty focus on his shyt. Dirt was going through so many trials and tribulations: He got arrested; he had personal problems, court dates; he's got a lot of children, a lot of women, a lot of people against him; and he's got a conspiracy in his head. Keeping him pinned down is a struggle. He might be in my house; I might wake up at twelve, he might've woken up at nine and left. I might find out he's locked up in L.A. But around February '99, we got serious, and Dirty's label, Elektra, got very serious. [Elektra president and CEO] Sylvia [Rhone] has a lot of love for ODB -- I think the label sees him as one of its children."
BUDDHA MONK, producer: "He wanted to go with more of a rock feel. Dirty just loves rock, period! Most of the tracks are extremely loud, and the vocals are screaming at you. At the same time, Dirty loves Gladys Knight and the Pips, the Four Tops, the Chi-Lites: music that's really about soul. Dirty was like, 'I've got all of this in me; now I have to bring it up to date.'"
RZA: "Musically, ODB wanted people partyin' and not to come so hardcore and raw. That's why he brought in those outside producers: to catch up to music trends. But when it came time to assemble the album, we listened to a lot of old Blowfly and Richard Pryor tapes, just buggin' out. I told Elektra that ODB wants a Grammy, but fukk going for the hip-hop Grammy; this shyt is funny -- let's go for the comedy Grammy!"
IRV GOTTI, producer: "I think Dirty's label gave him ten, twenty, thirty, maybe fifty thousand [dollars] every time he came to the studio -- to entice him."
RZA: "Dirty wanted $20 million to do this album. He was definitely pushing the buttons for green."
SYLVIA RHONE: "He does that [asks for money], but that's just Dirty. I never had to pay him to go into the studio. He was really anxious to do this album, really focused."
PHARREL WILLIAMS, the Neptunes: " 'Recognize' [the opening track] is a pimp song. We wanted to go with a pimp theme, because that's what Dirty does: He pimps this whole industry and all the bullshyt people assume."
BRIAN STANLEY, engineer on "Recognize": "We had already thought of a chorus for 'Recognize,' but Dirty didn't like it. Then Chris Rock happened to be working in the studio downstairs; he came by to say what's up to Dirty. Chris told Dirty he wanted him on his album, and Dirty said, 'Well, you do something for my album, I'll do something for your album.' Chris was like, 'Cool, call me whenever.' And Dirty was like, 'The mike's hooked up. Just go in there and do whatever you want.'"
KELIS, singer on "Got Your Money": "They had security downstairs because they had a little problem booking the session; I think Dirty has a reputation in New York now. When Dirty showed up, he was wearing two different shoes: one Timberland, one rubber boot. Overalls over sweat pants, one pair of eyeglasses and one pair of sunglasses. He was totally out there -- he lived up to his reputation, at least visually. He was having issues with the label. He stole the tape reel; no one could find him -- it was drama. That's why everybody loves him. No one knew what he was going to do, there was no beat on, and he just went in and started singing, 'Baby, I'll eat the shyt right up from out your ass.'"
RZA: "Elektra was very finicky about the album's being so vulgar. Sylvia Rhone is the president of the company, a strong black woman in the industry, and Dirty is all-out offensive to women. I told them that's how that man lives; that's the artistry of what he is."
RHONE: "I have my own opinions, but I have a responsibility to the artists to let them do their art. I've got to let Dirty be Dirty."
GOTTI: "Dirty did 'I Can't Wait' fast, in two or three hours. And he doesn't have nothing written: He just goes in and basically ad-libs the whole song. But it works. He goes line by line, overlapping tracks like he's two different people. It's all his personalities coming out, but it's all Dirty."
MONK: "At one session I was at, we were really off our motherfukkin' rockers -- we were high as hell. I was seeing twins, I was so drunk. And we'd go to the bathroom, and somebody would be in there sniffin' coke! And Dirty always has women at his sessions. We're all ready to do the song, and this girl wants to get on the album. We put the track on and let her start singing. Then Dirty was in there, fukking her in her ass while the track was rolling. He was hitting her head against the drum --that's why you be hearing funny sounds on the track!"
STANLEY: "One time, ODB and Pharrel were talking about loving people. Dirty was saying he loves everything and that everything on earth breathes air. He picked up a paper bag off the table and was like, 'This paper bag on the table breathes air. How'm I gonna leave this little nikka out? I love him.'"
RZA: "Last summer, after he got shot, Dirty ran out of the hospital, and I found him at his father's house. I picked him up and said, 'Hang out with me for a month.' We just drove through Ohio, through Boston; we had no destination. He still had his bandages on, and he had a Natalie Cole tape in his pocket that had 'Good Morning Heartache' on it. He put it in and started singing along. There was a van full of us, and tears were coming from all of us. We could feel the heartache that he goes through. He feels like he can't turn nowhere for that love that every man needs. We must've listened to that song a hundred times during our travels. I said to him, 'I need you to do this song on your album -- I need people to feel how you felt going through this.' I wanted him to do it with his mom. He didn't want to do that, so we got a studio singer with a nice voice. It adds a nice mood to the album. It takes you out of the comedy and puts you right into the world of his pain."
ALLI TRUCH, vice president of creative services, Elektra Records: "When I met with Dirty to talk about his concept for the album cover, he told me that he wanted to look like Rick James because he was doing a cover of [James'] 'Cold Blooded,' and he thought it would be funny. All he asked me for was a Rick James outfit and a Donna Summer outfit. He ended up wearing the Donna Summer wig with the Rick James outfit; as you know, Dirty is very creative."
RZA: "Rick James got into a lot of trouble. He kept a lot of bytches up in his crib, he had a problem with drugs, but he was a funky motherfukker. Just like ODB. You hear about the great brothers that we lost in the hip-hop industry like Tupac and Biggie, but Dirty's still here with that pain. He's a living example of it. They've got him in a place where he's got no access to things that keep your mind clouded --I think he's going to snap into a better reality. Nobody I've ever met is as strong as him to have survived the shyt he's survived: falling off roofs, getting shot and stabbed, constantly in some kind of trouble. He looks new every few months; I think he's a mutant."
BIG BABY, producer, Flavahood Productions: "A lot of people don't take the time to listen to him, so they don't understand -- they think he's a fool. But he's far from a fool. Sometimes it's the court jester that's actually controlling the court."
You serious? How can you like this album more than rzas golden productuion? The track Snakes alone bodies his whole second LPQuote:
Originally Posted by Sam the Seed
I banged the shit out of that album. 1 of the few second wave solos that wasn't a letdown. Favourite song: Cracker Jack (that beat!).
I actually like it more than the first
more unhinged
an actual solo
and it might be the purest best solo in wu catalog without any wu features.
pure classic. 4.5 mic imo. Best second gen wu album , SC aside (obviously).
was mad how the exec shit on the album. Was super ahead of its time and helped set up the neptunes as goto hiphop/pop singles before everyone sides nore.
return is classic but had they rehashed it again for pt 2 it would have fell flat. Both are perfect as is. I too think the second album is a better listen. The first album is more groundbreaking but the second is a perfect sequel album imo and the perfect blend of commercial vibes and wu tang. Thats who odb was.Quote:
Originally Posted by hotnikks
Return always felt like odbs intro to the world
but all the recorfs after from fantasy to ghetto superstar to got ya money was odb at his artistic/commercial peak
This was a good read, thanks. I got that this was from Rolling Stone? Seems to be from shortly afterwards, and before his death. (Especially since the article starts out with him 'being'.)Quote:
Originally Posted by Buddah_MAC
Didn't Sylvia Rhone not always see eye to eyet with Dirty. See comes of pretty political, 'I have my own opinions'. But overall has her peace now with Dirty.
The cover shoot is also a wild story. Don't know if Mannion ever completely told the story, but it was peak Dirty.
Still love the album. It might be short, but not as short as Beneath the Surface. Plus, let us not forget, Got Your Money was and still is a fucking banger. A high that people say Ghost has been chasing ever since. Besides that, a lot has already been written about the album I think, and it holds true. Dirty, by some stroke of genius, had The Neptunes before the properly blew up, and Irv Gotti and RZA on the same record, and it sounded like a Dirty record. Polished, but definetly Dirty. Fucking shout out to the eskimos.
By the way, was it not Buddha who claimed Got Your Money was about RZA, and Dirty wanted his money from him?
Any guest verse from ODB during this period, was always ODB at his fullest indeed. So you got one commercial hit after another, and he just does him. Don't forget The Fix remix with him and Slash.Quote:
Originally Posted by ForensikZ
I echo what everyone else said in this thread, it really was an album that was ahead of its time. I remember buying it 4 days after it was released, and just struggling to understand what direction he was trying to go with it from a flow/lyric perspective. And sonically it was all over the place with production from people I never heard of at the time. 99 was a weird year. But as time passed I recognized it for what it was instead of analyzing it; It’s Dirty’s soul album.
Gotta give props to whoever did the sequencing on the album. Putting Gettin’ High smack dab in the middle of the album was brilliant. Breaks the album into two pieces with a “classic Wu sound”
Strange to think I thought of that as a throwback track in 1999.Quote:
Originally Posted by Teejay
Same. Wasn’t that a reused beat? Was released on something else before this, can’t remember where/who. Think Buddha produced it, could be wrong thoQuote:
Originally Posted by phadde96
I am very shocked people like this better than his first. Peace
Dirty using the same verse 3 times on the first album, legendary. The Wu and Zu support fit the production perfectly.Quote:
Originally Posted by josborne3680
But the second one was just something different. That needed to be released, especially during that time period. People were fuxing AFRAID of this album. Haha!
But it doesn’t compare production wise to the first album. Gettin High is the only track that would fit seamlessly onto the first album….maybe the title track too, if I’m remembering correctly.
THANKS so much for this post! A peer asked about the ODB female guest in studio extra curricular sounds Buddah Monk story a few weeks ago so the timing was perfect! SUUUUUUUUU 👐🏽Quote:
Originally Posted by Buddah_MAC
Appreciation to all who posted to celebrate this anniv.! Was cool to read peoples' thoughts on ODBs 1st vs 2nd album
💥👐🏽💥
BUddha produced it indeed, according to the credits. The beat was also used for that Gravediggaz track, 'False Things Must Perish'.Quote:
Originally Posted by Teejay
Thank you for refreshing my memory Jet Set!! I KNEW I remembered a Prodigal verse on this beat. Poetic destroys this beat too. RIP.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jet Set
Still have the c.d. single for False Things Must Perish. Has a club mix on there also.
I know I’ve heard that Prodigal verse before this song was released too, can’t think where tho. I want to say a RZA solo track or maybe from Savior Dayz…Quote:
Originally Posted by David Daniel Davis
dont wanna be a Wu nazi but Beneath The Surface was GZA's 3rd album. But it's true that it's a classic album and has joins that can compete with Liquid SwordsQuote:
Originally Posted by Teejay
Haha! So true soob! My bad, always considered Words From as a “pre-Wu” album. But you’re definitely correct, BTS is his 3rd solo. I love how since LS with Bible, GZA solo albums have become a “home” for other Wu artists to have a chance to shine. BTS had Feel Like An Enemy that he wasn’t on, and that dope little outro with LA and Timbo. LOTLS had Rough Cut that he just did the chorus, Pro Tools had that song with Ka only… Just a cool tradition he seems to keep going with.Quote:
Originally Posted by soob
gzas albums always like that Kp solo on LS. Its a dope trademarkQuote:
Originally Posted by Teejay
if put second gen wu albums in thisnorder
supreme 5 mic
nigga please 4.5 mic
the pillage 4.25 mic
tical 2000 >=< BTS, changes daily 4 mic
Bobby digi = uncontrolled, both like 7/10. 3.5 mic
immobilarity 3 mic
golden arms 2.5 mic
You said it well. Nigga Please is the mos commercial Wu album and actually one of teh best commercial rap albums. It was very New Millennium but still very Golden Age hip-hop. And I love that there are no Wu members except RZA briefly and Brooklyn Zu. The first album had way too many guest fetaures IMO.ODB showed the Clan how to stand on your own without RZA and you can tell this album is what Ghost emulated for The Pretty Toney Album, which is the only other really commercial Wu album that works.Quote:
Originally Posted by ForensikZ
But Dirty's lyrics and delivery on this are just incredible. Really shows you why he was the Unique Ason. The way he could throw in Mathematics while being goofy and surreal is one of a kind. Its just a feel good album but still dirty. And I prefer a lot of the production on this. First album was a lot of muddy beats without enough variation. This one was bumping Down South club rap that was cutting edge for a NYC album. ODB shouting out Outkast was huge.
Of all the Wu albums, I would use this one to introduce to today's rap kids. It feels like the godfather of Young Thug and XXXTentacion. Not most hardcore Wu fans' bag but its mine. Sucks he didn't get to do a proper 3rd album.
i agree. Way i see it. Return was wu tang style, nuh please was commercial style blended with some wu. Im not sure odb wanted to do much of anything but get high… but i do believe he wanted to make that album that way so it really shows me who he was. He could do wu tang, west coast, rock n roll. Etc. limiting him would be a mistake and im happy it turned oht that way cuz if you think about it, he has one of the better 1-2 punches on the solo tip. Ghost needed the clan on supreme still. Odb didnt. For a guy as crazy as him to do it without them when they all couldnt…For that, I give him props. Shame what happened but im glad some of you have turned around on the album as its a gem.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam the Seed
Spit That G.Quote:
Originally Posted by Teejay
Thanks Hollow, I knew I heard it somewhere.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollow Dartz
So they did three songs that night. LA was on all of them. There is another one produced by RZA in that three that's apparently amazing, and there's another one just LA and ODb over a Tru Master beat. I recently got to hear that one and it was super. Hope they see the light of day.Quote:
Originally Posted by phadde96
With the intention of being on the NP album, or slated for a different release? I suppose our best chance of hearing them would be if/when LA releases a Heist 2 or if/when Tru re-releases Master Craftsman with the extra tracks that he said were supposed to be on there originally.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cilvaringz
We will probably get that Master Craftsman rerelease, but I highly doubt that we will get that Heist Of The Century II, La The Darkman made a lot of money being one of the executive producers over at Aphilliates. He has not released it because he does not have to, he is eating good and pretty comfortable for the rest of his life. If you copped all of his mix tapes, then you have pretty much heard the entire album as it is scattered across those various releases.
Yeah I gave up on that La album. He randomly puts up an IG post once a year saying "Heist of the Century II dropping next week" lol
That’s an interesting theory, LA using his Heist 2 lyrics for those countless mixtapes he’s been releasing since the original Heist. Similar to GZA seemingly spreading his Dark Matter album lyrics across everything he’s been featured on since ABT. I actually think LA is still sitting on those lyrics, I personally didn’t get the vibe from those mixtapes that what we were hearing was H2 material. Dare I say I still think “It’s Coming….”Quote:
Originally Posted by David Daniel Davis
My hope is once these tours and residency’s die down a little we’ll start getting some music from the Wu camp. U-God, MK and Rae in particular.