Do Too Many Guest Features Cheapen a Brand?

[Merc Versus]

When underground artists spend money to collect various features from underground rappers, such as Wu affiliates, does it help or hurt that guest's movement?

I understand that it immediately helps the paid featured artist, but in the grand scheme of things does this type of business both cheapen the brand name and fatten the pockets of opportunists and middlemen who really don't know or care about the artists they're peddling?

I have read a lot of complaints from fans here and elsewhere saying that the Wu brand has been diluted by too many guest features with sub-par artists that then get overzealous and want to claim membership of something in which they have no business.

Did corporate greed, coupled with a lack of both tact and good management on the part of sought after featured artists result in the collapse of some of our favorite artistic collectives?

[check two]

Is that you?

[Merc Versus]

Indeed. Be on the lookout for my upcoming release featuring Canibus, Planet Asia, Timbo King, Solomon Childs, Buddha Monk, Lord Superb, Young MC, Coolio, and Celine Dion.

[TSA]

I really doubt you can do this my nigga

[zooruka]

the Wu brand has been diluted by too many guest features with sub-par artists that then get overzealous and want to claim membership of something in which they have no business.

I agree that the wu tang brand has be diluted. They should have only picked the best of the best to rep the W. Having said that, M.C's like streetlife and killa sin are ill and would have probably never been heard if it wasn't for the Wu putting them on.

[muscularghandi]

Not when it's the actual Clan doing the features. Guys like Streetlife, Trife, Leathaface, Superb, and all the other General's little "sidekicks", even though they ARE good at times, make albums not as good as they could have been.

I was just listening to Tical today and was thinking how much better it would have been with a couple features from Ghostface and Co.

[zooruka]

Guys like Streetlife, even though they ARE good at times, make albums not as good as they could have been.

Seriously ?????

[muscularghandi]

Seriously ?????

Yea seriously. But I'm talking more so on solo shit with less tracks, it's hard for anybody to cheapen a Wu-Tang 2XLP with almost 30 tracks. And don't get me wrong, I know these dudes are nice and have 5 star verses, but imagine Tical without Carlton Fisk and instead you insert Rae, Ghost, or GZA. On Golden Arms, Drop Leatha Face from those 4 songs and replace him with ANY Generals, that album doubles in overall quality. Then again with Bulletproof Wallets for Trife and Superb. Maybe you feel different, but when all those dudes come in it's a bit of a disappointment.

[zooruka]

Yea seriously. But I'm talking more so on solo shit with less tracks, it's hard for anybody to cheapen a Wu-Tang 2XLP with almost 30 tracks. And don't get me wrong, I know these dudes are nice and have 5 star verses, but imagine Tical without Carlton Fisk and instead you insert Rae, Ghost, or GZA. On Golden Arms, Drop Leatha Face from those 4 songs and replace him with ANY Generals, that album doubles in overall quality. Then again with Bulletproof Wallets for Trife and Superb. Maybe you feel different, but when all those dudes come in it's a bit of a disappointment.

My main argument was that you included Streetlife. I kind agree about the other Wu tang affiliates though.

[JEM]

Yea seriously. But I'm talking more so on solo shit with less tracks, it's hard for anybody to cheapen a Wu-Tang 2XLP with almost 30 tracks. And don't get me wrong, I know these dudes are nice and have 5 star verses, but imagine Tical without Carlton Fisk and instead you insert Rae, Ghost, or GZA. On Golden Arms, Drop Leatha Face from those 4 songs and replace him with ANY Generals, that album doubles in overall quality. Then again with Bulletproof Wallets for Trife and Superb. Maybe you feel different, but when all those dudes come in it's a bit of a disappointment.

what? Carlton Fisk killed his spots. Alot of you fans forget that YOU are the ones on the sidelines..and dont even live this shit. SOME of the dudes with not such a big name as the generals play very vital roles to the artists movements. You dont see everything that goes on behind the scenes..and you dont know what it means to go to war in this music industry..and have your ppl giving their life for this shit to make sure you got your bases covered. Most of the dudes you see on tracks earned their spot...and held them down when they got it music wise. On the other hand...the industry has changed so much...that features have become a money maker kind of like shows..and artists gotta eat...so you see alot more features being done today. Dudes out there paying for features just gotta know that you cant pay for legendary status...that shit comes with timeless skill, hard work and consistency.

[Merc Versus]

In my initial post, I wasn't referring to the official affiliates. What I meant was up and coming underground or local artists that come out of the blue and think that having a Wu affiliate on their project somehow makes them part of the Wu-Tang movement. I'm sure a lot of these cats couldn't even name 3 songs by the likes of Killah Priest or Gravediggaz.

Wu-Tang Clan
Sunz of Man
Wu-Syndicate
Black Knights
Gravediggaz
Northstar
Cappadonna
Shyheim
La the Darkman
Killarmy
Street Life
Carlton Fisk
Begga Clan
Solomon Childs
Timbo King
Wisemen
Cilvaringz
Shabazz the Disciple
Trife Da God
Brooklyn Zu

...and various other affiliates are considered official grain, I understand that. By cheapening the brand I meant promoters/managers having a field day putting everyone and everything on the market and making it confusing to those that don't know shit about the history of Wu-Tang and presenting an illusion to the public in terms of who is affiliated and who isn't. I think the root of it is money, not respect for the movement or knowledge of its history.

Now it seems that anybody with a few hundred to a few thousand dollars can select their level of Wu-Tang connection by paying for guest features and opening performance slots. I think this is part of what shifted the paradigm from lyrics being respected to swag taking over. There was never an official change of the guard. The future development of the culture was left in the hands of greedy opportunists.

[TSA]

Yea seriously. But I'm talking more so on solo shit with less tracks, it's hard for anybody to cheapen a Wu-Tang 2XLP with almost 30 tracks. And don't get me wrong, I know these dudes are nice and have 5 star verses, but imagine Tical without Carlton Fisk and instead you insert Rae, Ghost, or GZA. On Golden Arms, Drop Leatha Face from those 4 songs and replace him with ANY Generals, that album doubles in overall quality. Then again with Bulletproof Wallets for Trife and Superb. Maybe you feel different, but when all those dudes come in it's a bit of a disappointment.

Fisk dropped what's arguably one of the best verses on the album. The only person someones a general is because they've been called that and they don't have a monopoly of good verses or sounding good on a beat

[zooruka]

I think Streetlife and not Cappadonna should have been made a general.

[Rev Jones]

I think Streetlife and not Cappadonna should have been made a general.

If his first batch of recorded verses wasn't ghostwritten (I honestly have no idea), Cappa was definitely up there with the other generals in the first years in terms of quality.

Streetlife is solid, doesn't stand out much though. Carlton Fisk was excellent before he took an extended iron vacation. I want to hear a Carlton Fisk solo album. But that's never going to happen.

If anyone should have been made an additional general, it would have been Killah Priest.

Back on topic. People like Cappa might be considered as guilty of diluting the Wu brand because he records with literally anybody. Just check him on Youtube. Tons of videos with unknowns who often possess questionable skills. Then again, I don't blame him for getting a paycheck at all.

You could also look at it another way and consider the 'Wu brand' to be group and solo general albums only.

[zooruka]

Cappa was definitely up there with the other generals in the first years in terms of quality.

I disagree.

Streetlife is solid, doesn't stand out much though.

Streetlife is a better m.c in my opinion. Streetlife's verses on Wu tang Forever >>>>> Anything Cappa has spit.