Does God Exist

[Robert]

sorry for the length but I find this quite interesting:

I love how the author tries to put the onus on science to prove that there isn't an intelligent force behind life.

He uses rudimentary chemistry and suggests that the mathematical arrangements of atoms and DNA prove they were designed intelligently without actually explaining how this occurred or why this must be the case.

The problem with the article for me is the guy talks in absolutes.

"If this happens then this is the only explaination"

I'm afraid that isn't evidence, it's a logical fallacy.

[Robert]

the concept of having immutable laws verses nothing to live by seems more confronting to me.

Why do "immutable" laws have to be the result of an intelligent force?

I don't know what your concept of god is - but I do not think that I am going to "heaven" simply by believing in god, nor do I believe in Jesus -
nor am I relying on anything other than myself to save me.

To me your idea of god is irrelevant in some ways. It's your application of that idea that I'm interested in.

...like I said, just what concept of god do you think I "believe in" in the first place before you are qualified to tell me I have no reason to know it?

I'm certain I never said "you have no reason to know it". I questioned you about evolution and your right brain/left brian theory.

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[Mumm Ra]

the concept of having immutable laws verses nothing to live by seems more confronting to me.

Why do "immutable" laws have to be the result of an intelligent force?

it's not a result - it is the intelligent force
the same way gravity is an immutable law there are immutable spiritual laws for man

I don't know what your concept of god is - but I do not think that I am going to "heaven" simply by believing in god, nor do I believe in Jesus -
nor am I relying on anything other than myself to save me.

To me your idea of god is irrelevant in some ways. It's your application of that idea that I'm interested in.

no - my application IS my idea.
you can't have one without the other.
...if you ignore the law of gravity you are liable to jump out a window and kill yourself - the law of gravity will be there regardless of what you want to believe

[Robert]

it's not a result - it is the intelligent force
the same way gravity is an immutable law there are immutable spiritual laws for man

Ok, why is it the intelligent force?

no - my application IS my idea.
you can't have one without the other.

I see.

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[Mumm Ra]

it's not a result - it is the intelligent force
the same way gravity is an immutable law there are immutable spiritual laws for man

Ok, why is it the intelligent force?

I'd have to go back to the article you read that you dismissed as not showing intelligence -
I personally view perfect law and order in all corners of the universe as something to be considered intelligent.
That there even ARE physical and spiritual laws that cannot be broken, or in man's case, would lead to misfortune 100% of the time - I would not call random or chaotic, but rather intelligent.
How the physical matter of a fetus knows how to grow to adulthood I would call intelligent, or how the trillions of individual cells work together as a fully functioning conscious human.
I guess it depends on your idea of the word intelligent which you've shown differs from mine.

[Robert]

I'd have to go back to the article you read that you dismissed as not showing intelligence -
I personally view perfect law and order in all corners of the universe as something to be considered intelligent.

Fair enough. My view is that just because there is currently no explaination for what you call "perfect law" it does not mean it is "intelligent".

That there even ARE physical and spiritual laws that cannot be broken, or in man's case, would lead to misfortune 100% of the time - I would not call random or chaotic, but rather intelligent.
How the physical matter of a fetus knows how to grow to adulthood I would call intelligent, or how the trillions of individual cells work together as a fully functioning conscious human.
I guess it depends on your idea of the word intelligent which you've shown differs from mine.

Good call. I understand your view point a whole lot better now.

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[Slippy The Pimp]

Does God Exist?

Simple answer, yes.

In my travels across the globe I have seen the contours of his creation. Felt his breath on my skin, his hand on my back, and heard his voice in my heart. I felt his power resonate through my body for an entire year, and transform me into a better person. This is not some mystery to be solved, because we can not solve it. If you seek evidence you only need to listen, observe, feel, smell, and touch. Only then will you feel his power when he is near. His presence in your existence will be undeniable.

Simple science is not enough, neither is faith. It takes a combination to comprehend the complexity of creation. It takes sacrifice for another human being to understand why children suffer. It takes discipline when others have none. You can not find God in a book, only comfort or more questions. You can not understand him through someone else's understanding. You can only look for guidance when you have none.

I shook hands with ghosts, sang with spirits, and danced with the thunder. I fear no man or earthly creature, I only fear what will happen if they fear me. I never claim to know more than another in these matters, because it does not matter. These discussions are meaningless if you can not find God in your own life, you only serve to prove your ignorance of what is surrounding you every day. I do not look for god in the news or in catasrophe. I don't seek god in the actions of evil men, or in the in action of good people. God reveals himself to me in his own accord and that is enough for me.