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Thread: <<China WATCH>>

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    Chaotician ShaDynasty's Avatar
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    Default <<China WATCH>>

    I think this might be a useful thread to sort of catalog all the abhorrent shit that's going on, and will continue to go on in our lifetimes (as long as this sites running).

    The things China do are going to shape this century to a great extent, especially the west's reactions to what they do. Do we continue to give them a pass for atrocities because $$$? Do China essentially get to do their Orwellian nightmare version of globalization on civilization?

    Anyway post some news stories, videos. Discuss.

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    Chaotician ShaDynasty's Avatar
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    China’s government runs a gargantuan system of direct censorship – in 2013, it was estimated to be employing 2 million people to monitor and censor internet content – but perhaps even more important is the way it enforces a climate of self-censorship. The scholar Perry Link once described the threat posed by Chinese censors as being less like “a man-eating tiger or fire-snorting dragon” than “a giant anaconda coiled in an overhead chandelier”. He continued: “Normally the great snake doesn’t move. It doesn’t have to. It feels no need to be clear about its prohibitions. Its constant silent message is: ‘You yourself decide.’”
    In the video game industry, as in many sectors, most censorship is not about top-down directives. Because the official guidelines are so vague, foreign developers tend to abide by a fuzzy, speculative and ever-changing set of unwritten “rules”, many of which are gleaned from trial and error. Time travel, for example, is considered best avoided. “I’m not 100% sure why,” said the industry insider I spoke to. “But from what I heard it’s because the government doesn’t want the people to think there is a possibility of going back in time and changing the party regime.” Lokman Tsui, the Chinese censorship expert, suggested this may be true, pointing out that history and science fiction have sometimes been used to surreptitiously criticise the government. “For a while, history was a loophole for discussing political stuff,” he said. “You would tell tales to make political commentary. I don’t know if that is similar for time travel, but I can imagine there is some similar logic going on there.”


    https://www.theguardian.com/news/202...tease-blizzard

    Good article about their censorship of videogames.

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    #halmustgo Hal Incandenza's Avatar
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    Good thread idea.

    Partly in contrast to the info provided in the article above the Chinese government changed its stance on science fiction literature a few years ago. Before, scifi was deemed unnecessary and escapist. Probably had 'unwanted' ideas too.

    But in an effort to enthuse children and teens for science, so they study to become scientists, scifi has received an enormous push from the government.

    This includes cons, prizes for writers, support for magazines.

    How do I know? By affiliation. My best friend is a short story writer who specializes in scifi and absurd stories. While he has a limited audience in the home country, his stories have been picked up in China by magazines that often have over a million subscribers. For each subscriber, count about four actual readers since China has a tradition of passing on magazines to relatives and friends.

    The scifi magazine industry in China was close to death a few years ago. Now it is thriving. Due to official push and funding.

    On a sidenote it is interesting to see foreign authors (like my friend) are welcomed as well.

    Knowing China this may no longer be the case in 10 years time.

    On another sidenote, it is extremely difficult to get published as a foreign scifi writer in Japan - where scifi is of course huge.

    Just thought I'd share.

    If I come across anything China related I'll post it here.

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    Hal is right. Good thread. We all should say, "It's China's time." Why? Countries like the US countries in Europe have assisted with China's growth in power. Why is China in Africa so much?
    Loyalty is Royalty. Strength and Loyalty

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    #halmustgo Hal Incandenza's Avatar
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    Chaotician ShaDynasty's Avatar
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    One thing thats worrying is the amount of money they have invested in both the west and the developing world. It already affects media and censorship and it potentially could get a lot worse if we don't stop accepting chinese investments and trade. Capitalists really only care about the bottom line, so they'll never care about the fallout from increased Chinese influence.

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    Hanovallah HANZO's Avatar
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    One of the more hilarious China investments is the highway to nowhere in Montenegro.

    The billion-dollar motorway leading Montenegro to nowhere | Euronews

    They basically own Montenegro now and for nothing. Probably bribed some public officials to sign off on the deal in order to have a tight grip on the nation.

    They've done the same in Iran. Iranian fisherman can't fish in their own waters anymore, the Chinese have priority. In return the Chinese have saved them from financial collapse.

    In Turkey the Govt is desperate for cash because they've squandered it all on making party loyalists billionaires through incredibly fruitful Govt contracts. The President's next vanity project is the oh so useless Canal Istanbul. He wants to build another water way through the city, build 6 bridges and 2 cities on either side of the canal. He needs money and the Chinese will probably pay for it but obviously will want a shit ton in return. One is obviously to keep quiet about the Uygurs which Turkey is doing. When the Chinese foreign minister visited a few months ago the leader of the Uygurs in Turkey told through the Covid app that he had tested positive and had to stay indoors. He didn't have Covid, didn't even take a test but they made sure police were outside his house making sure he don't leave in order to protest the Chinese FM's arrival. They've also handed over countless Uygurs to China and you get plenty China apologists go on TV and tell the country that Uygurs aren't actually Turks and just a fake people created by the evil United States.
    Last edited by HANZO; 07-17-2021 at 06:41 AM.

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    Anglophile Dooch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HANZO View Post
    One of the more hilarious China investments is the highway to nowhere in Montenegro.

    The billion-dollar motorway leading Montenegro to nowhere | Euronews

    They basically own Montenegro now and for nothing. Probably bribed some public officials to sign off on the deal in order to have a tight grip on the nation.

    They've done the same in Iran. Iranian fisherman can't fish in their own waters anymore, the Chinese have priority. In return the Chinese have saved them financial collapse.

    In Turkey the Govt is desperate for cash because they've squandered it all on making party loyalists billionaires through incredibly fruitful Govt contracts. The President's next vanity project is the oh so useless Canal Istanbul. He wants to build another water way through the city, build 6 bridges and 2 cities on either side of the canal. He needs money and the Chinese will probably pay for it but obviously will want a shit ton in return. One is obviously to keep quiet about the Uygurs which Turkey is doing. When the Chinese foreign minister visited a few months ago the leader of the Uygurs in Turkey told through the Covid app that he had tested positive and had to stay indoors. He didn't have Covid, didn't even take a test but they made sure police were outside his house making sure he don't leave in order to protest the Chinese FM's arrival. They've also handed over countless Uygurs to China and you get plenty China apologists go on TV and tell the country that Uygurs aren't actually Turks and just a fake people created by the evil United States.
    Lol that’s crazy.

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    'The Fourhorsemen' TSA's Avatar
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    I don't really see the threat if you don't have a land border with them. Their man concern is internal 'harmony' (continuing to create government hell for themselves), so there will be less china shit talking in the next 10 years and beyond, but they're way better than the US being in power because they don't need to have a major war every few years to stay buoyant. Sucks for they Ugyurs but all those borat countries do is come to the US, drive ubers and be racist so that's their business. I'm sure a lot of them are cool too but it's whatever.


    Everyone in east asia is fucked and the level of fucked will decrease with severity as you pan away from China. I predict Japan in the next 15 years will start reforming it's self to look more like China. And in a drastic way.

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    'The Fourhorsemen' TSA's Avatar
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    I was tripping about the Uber thing and the website won't let me edit it out. My bad, the situation is really bad for them, but they're still probably lame.

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    Chaotician ShaDynasty's Avatar
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    TSA you sound like a teenager.

    Japan won't model themselves after China, people there generally dislike the chinese and enjoy personal freedoms that the chinese don't. Nobody will trade that in to live in an episode of Black Mirror. The Japanese basically love Japan and don't give a shit about globalization.

    I doubt there will be any border wars either, wars are pretty rare these days. We live in the digital age, what China is doing is spreading influence and leveraging power in neighbor states and beyond.

    I think it could easily go the other way though, the average western (even conservative) values are diametrically opposed to the CCP. At some point the clash will be unavoidable.

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    #halmustgo Hal Incandenza's Avatar
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    There are tensions between India and China.

    More generally speaking there are loads of territorial conflicts about border regions between China and the various, often small states surrounding China and India or close to these countries. Some of these conflicts go back centuries.

    Here's a non exhaustive overview. There are many more disputes.



    The Japanese are very self absorbed and generally racist to other cultures in that they think their way is superior (really, which culture doesn't). It is notoriously difficult for outsiders (foreigners) to really integrate themselves in Japanese society on a level of mutual and equal respect.

    Because of WWII there is still a lot of leftover tension between China and Japan. There is of course also economic powerplay.

    Here is an overview of Chinese Japanese hustory and relations

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hist...apan_relations

    Finally, here's an online report / newspaper article I enjoyed reading about how Westerners ('Westerners') possibly misinterpret China and its development, in tge form of debunking 3 (perceived?) myths

    https://hbr.org/2021/05/what-the-wes...ng-about-china
    Last edited by Hal Incandenza; 07-17-2021 at 03:59 AM.

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    Anglophile Dooch's Avatar
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    The “borats” are racist the Japanese are now “racist”, the Italian national team was “racist” because it was compromised of ethnic Italians.

    What’s wrong with you type of people? Don’t you have any nuance?

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    #halmustgo Hal Incandenza's Avatar
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    everybody's racist

    REJOICE

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    'The Fourhorsemen' TSA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ShaDynasty View Post
    TSA you sound like a teenager.

    Japan won't model themselves after China, people there generally dislike the chinese and enjoy personal freedoms that the chinese don't. Nobody will trade that in to live in an episode of Black Mirror. The Japanese basically love Japan and don't give a shit about globalization.

    I doubt there will be any border wars either, wars are pretty rare these days. We live in the digital age, what China is doing is spreading influence and leveraging power in neighbor states and beyond.

    I think it could easily go the other way though, the average western (even conservative) values are diametrically opposed to the CCP. At some point the clash will be unavoidable.
    eh, maybe, but oh well. Japan will switch. All of this is has historical pattern and precedent, and confucious influenced cultures and inclined to celebrate all of the things we think are 'totalitarian' about China. Social harmony is very important to them and China is 'perfecting' the formula. The threat from China will cause Japan to start being more China-like to compete. Japanese people also love globalization like everyone else lol. I don't even know how that came up . Westerners have a very idiotic idealistic idea of what Japan is and then go to Japan and start considering killing themselves.

    China will be worst for ppl in their immediate space than people 'further away'. China isn't Europe where it needs resources from elsewhere for basic survival. China's main concern is making sure nothing/nobody from the outside can disrupt the party from within. But all china needs is China all of this shit they're doing is to assure that resource (China) stays intact. They can get anything they want resource wise without being dramatic or violent so it will be less of a threat to other countries than the US Russia France and co.

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