If God exists then we should have him abolished -Mikhail Bakunin
If God exists then we should have him abolished -Mikhail Bakunin
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"Allah! There is no god but He, - the Living, the Self-subsisting, Eternal. No slumber can seize Him nor sleep. His are all things in the heavens and on earth. Who is there can intercede in His presence except as He permitteth? He knoweth what (appeareth to His creatures as) before or after or behind them. Nor shall they compass aught of His knowledge except as He willeth. His Throne doth extend over the heavens and the earth, and He feeleth no fatigue in guarding and preserving them for He is the Most High, the Supreme (in glory). "-Quran 2:255, "Ayat al-Kursi"
"Fear God and you will have no cause to fear anyone."-Hazrat Ali (Radi Allahu Ahnu)
Originally Posted by Eric Unseen
Why didnt god have to come from somewhere?
You cant say one did and the other didnt. If thats your reasoning you have a fallacy.
A fallacy is, very generally, an error in reasoning. To be more specific, a fallacy is an "argument" in which the premises given for the conclusion do not provide the needed degree of support.
In particular you have a cause and effect fallacy.
This fallacy is committed when a person assumes that one event must cause another just because the events occur in a supposed order. The mistake being made is that the causal conclusion is being drawn without adequate justification.
The earth is a very small stage in a vast cosmic arena. Think of the rivers of blood spilled by all those generals and emperors so that in glory and in triumph they could become the momentary masters of a fraction of a dot.
People are too stupid to effectively conspire to do anything, but not too stupid to come up with conspiracy theories.
Some believe that the meterorite that struck the earth and killed the dinosaurs had bacteria on it which led to the first steps of evolution. That along with the radiation from the meteor causing the basic genetic matter to mutate, and begin the million year long mission to get to being ameobi. I kinda summarised this viewpoint, and am no expert on it, it's just something accumulated from word of mouth, coupled with the discovery channel (the latter being an assumption).
As for the existence of the devine being. I believe there are beings which are what you would call 'omnipotent' but they didn't create everything, they live outside of the realms of time and space, meaning they were here from the very very beginning (whichcver big bang was the first). I base this partly on the idea of there being a 'natural order' to things, where whatever these beings are, are at the top. And we, are somewhere near the bottom. I also believe that those at the top of the ladder care very little for the goings on of those near the bottom - Like with humans and cockroaches, for example.
The one negative I can think of is the concept of God, which spawned from organised religion. The idea of being afraid of what's above and below us is what holds us back from the next step in the progression of this race. Some people need to be afraid of the forces which hold this universe together, and that's cool, there's nothing wrong with being scared and all. But things do need to move on. Though if I'm wrong, I won't need to worry about it as I'll be dead by that time haha
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I really can´t understand some of You. Somebody said, he hates God... For me God is the One I can put all my trust into. Even when I´m going through hard times I know I can always rely on him.`Cause those hard times only make me stronger and wiser. See hardships as lessons...Of course at the first look I can´t prove to You that God exists.. But then again when I hear some beatiful music or see a beatiful sunrise I can´t help myself, but say : damn, God HAS to exist. Try not to look at Him in a religious way. Religion mostly creates a false image of God. All You have to do is try to SEE! Open Your eyes! Look inside Your heart and You will find GOD. And once You found Him, he´ll never gonna leave You alone anymore!Trust me! PEACE!
THERE HAS BEEN A LOT OF DEBATE OF GOD SO I WANT TO KNOW WHAT U THINK GOD IS
DO U BELIEVE IN GOD? YES
WHO IS GOD? THE HOLY MOST HIGH AND RULER OR EVERTHING
IS IT A PERSON OR THING? PERSON
IF IT IS A PERSON THEN IS THAT PERSON A HE OR SHE? HE
IF IT IS A THING THEN WHAT IS IT? NOT A THING
IS THERE ONLY ONE GOD OR MANY? ONE
WHY IS GOD CALLED YAHWEH IN SOME TEXT BUT ALLAH IN OTHERS? GOD HAS MANY NAMES
WHAT IS YOUR VIEW ON GOD? HE IS ALWAYS WITH ME
DO U FEAR GOD? IF U HEAR HIM SPEAK U WILL FEAR HIM TOO
DO U LOVE OR HATE GOD? LOVE
DO U RESPECT GOD? YES
DO U SEEK GOD OR DO U SEEK SOMETHING ELSE? I SEEK GOD
DO U FEEL IT IS BETTER TO LIVE BY THE WORD OF GOD OR BY THE WORD OF MAN? THE WORD OF MAN WILL ONLY LEAD U INTO RUINS WHILE THE WORD OF GOD WILL LEAD U CORRECT
IF THERE IS ANYTHING ELSE U WOULD LIKE TO ADD TO THIS PLEASE DO SO
IT IS BETTER TO NEVER HAVE BEEN BORN THEN TO BE WITH OUT GOD
Last edited by hectis; 03-28-2006 at 10:27 PM.
Impeach god, lol....."vote mashquack for god"
in my experience on evolution and theology, i have never heard this interpretation.
i think u are confusing 2 issues.
evolution was "in process" the second that there was a population of microorganisms with a mode of replication and inheritance, thus evolution was working billions of years before an asteroid struck the earth and potentially killed off the dinos.
i think what u meant was that the killing off of the dinos is what prompted the course of "modern" mammalian evolution and thus humanity.
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because when you think God ain't for real it's like sayin' you're not for real. You're mind ain't for real. You're feelin' ain't for real. Your humanity ain't for real. Your creativity ain't for real. Everythin' in life ain't for real. And yeah believe it. it's connected.
How we're 4 real?first you feel things and you whitey, act to these feelings. You don't let go. If it wasn't for real, you wouldn't cry the day you were born. If it wasn't for real, you wouldn't fight with anyone in your life coz they pissed you off. If it wasn't for real, you wouldn't feel hurt, you wouldn't feel embarrassed, you wouldn't feel good, you wouldn't feel bad or feel anything and you won't be able to touch anything if it ain't for real.
How is it insulting to your intelligence to think that there is no God?
you know as an intelligent human being, that everything happens for a reason. And every act has a re-act. I mean even a very simple things make you wonder who did this and who did that? Check it in your daily life. If you still live with your parents, you wake up in the early mornin' the breakfast is cooked. “oh it has to be mum” you never thought it was made by itself, did you? or It wasn't the boggy man, was he?
And even if you were the best geologic scientist you'll keep listin' to me the whole process of how somethin' happens then it has to come to a point when you stop and i ain't talkin' about the lack of knowledge about geology or somethin' but it's just too beyond what any human being can get to or it just against all what he was learned in his best college.
Why nothing is made by itself like Rocks?!
Some might say something about maybe how the wind blows up and shape mountains and then little rocks fall down and gather with bigger ones and in the rainy days they become mud or somethin' then again when the weather is dry and sunny, the little rocks become one big rock. Blah blah blah..
yeah ok i got it, but who moved the wind? Who changed the weather? Who shaped the land in a way that made the rocks gather in certain spot?
Everything is motivated by something. The feelings and the behaviors are effected and motivated by other things though they aren't touchable.
Then how the things that are touchable can't be motivated by something or someone?
to say that the rock is made or shaped by the wind. It's like sayin' it was the oven that cooked my food. It's absolutely true but you ain't goin' to disbelieve in Allah “God” just cause you know how the happenings was done.
I know the examples don't match in the level but i tried to use them coz they're easy to understand and to see.
Man,that shows who in here build his statements on guesses and assumptions. The big religions and here i suppose you're talking about Islam, Christianity and Judaism. They aren't popped up at the same time. Islam was revealed in 611 A.C that means like 1427 ago and Christianity was revealed 2006 years ago.
when there was no good science or explanations to certain things?
What is the hell that suppose to mean, you ignorant?! Lemme tell ya somethin' first of all and believe it or not, those religions revealed upon people using the best that the people had at that time. I mean when Christianity came to its people by prophet Jesus -may Allah's peace upon him- the people was the best at medicine. And the miracles of Jesus were so related to what his people are good at. He could cure leper and blindness-by the will of Allah- and he could revive deads -by the will of Allah-“God”.When Islam was revealed upon Prophet Muhammad -may Allah's peace be upon him- Allah all-knowing knew that the best thing is using what the people are good at. He almighty ain't gonna tell people about cars when all they're good at is somethin' else. Koran was raveled speakin' to what the people were good at and because it's the last message from God it contains what will happen in the future and what happened in the past. The people of Muhammad were so articulate, fluent and eloquent. That means that the Koran has the greatest evidences that talk with people minds and prove logically the existence of god and how things go. So that shows that those three religions convinced people and proved to them real facts the people were the best at. It ain't like they were ignorants and they were used.
This is stupid!
Should they had last model weapons like we have today so they make people submit to their wishes by scaring them?! They had other weapons and had other ways of torturing people to make them submit.
Beside the prophets that those religions were revealed upon are had the best manners among their people. Their own people knew them for being honest and never tell lies.
Nothing wrong about fearing god when you make a mistake, that makes you a better human being. It makes you watch it out for the next time and not to repeat the same mistake. It makes you kind to people. It makes you just, humble and wise.
Awww thank youuuuuuuuuuuuuuu that's so what i was looking for in a question. Coz in Koran there are plenty a lot of signs. Maybe in each verse. But since i usually post long posts i won't make it longer than it's already is. But few examples for an ignorant who pretend to read holy books including Koran and obviously he doesn't.
1)It was Allah who sends the winds, and they raise the clouds: then they spread them in the sky as he wills, and breaks them into fragments, until you see rain-drops issue from the midst thereof: then when He has made them reach such of his servants as He wills, behold they rejoice-
verse No. 48, chapter the roman empire Surah No.30
2)It is Allah who sends forth the winds, so that they raise up the clouds, and we drive them to a land that is dead, and revive the earth therewith after its death: even so (will be) the resurrection.
verse No. 9, chapter the Fatir, or the orginator of the creation Surah No.35
3)Don't you see that Allah sends down rain from the sky, and leads it through springs in the earth? Then he causes the glow, therewith, produce of various colors: then it withers; you will see it grow yellow; then He makes it dry up and crumble away. Truly in this is a message of remembrance to men of understanding.
verse No. 21, chapter the crowds Surah No.39
O wait, they did happen but if you didn't catch up with then it's just another story.
yeah that's the part where i suppose to look like that helpless sista who is so controlled by some old stories or myths. But guess what, as long as it the truth, i'm happy that i'm controlled by that.
here is some exclusive for you and i picked'em up coz they typically talk about people like yourself.
Verse #77Does not man see that it is We who created him from sperm yet behold! He (stands forth) as an open adversary!
Verse #78And he makes comparisons for Us, and forgets his own (origins and) creation: he says, “who can give life to (dry) bones and decomposed ones at that?”
Verse #79say “He will give them life who created them for the first time! For he is well-versed in every kind of creation!-3
Verse #80“The same who produces for you fire out of the green tree when behold! You kindle therewith (your own fires)
Verse #81“Is not He who created the heaven and earth able to create the like thereof?”- yes indeed for He is the creator supreme of skill and knowledge (infinite)!
Verse #82 "Verily, when he intend a thing, his command is, “Be and it is”
Verse #83:"So glory to him in whose hands is dominion of all things: and to him will you be all brought back".
Chapter Ya-sin surah #36
Last edited by sweet sista; 04-03-2006 at 01:13 AM.
( )----mark of my own thoughts
So Whitey, are you saying that there's not adequate justification for saying that humans evolved from a single-cell organism? or just saying because there were single-cell creatures we evolved from doesn't mean that they had a creator? I would still say that you'd be hard-pressed to find anything in the scientific world that doesn't at least have a debate going on about it's orgins (in biology or astronomy, anyways) You being really wordy doesn't mean my question is based upon a fallacy, just that you'll use it as a weapon when confronted with a difficult question., which still remains, Where did the single-cell organisms come from?
do you know the difference between something that was made and something that was created ?
1 a : FICTITIOUS, INVENTED <a made excuse> b : artificially produced c : put together of various ingredients <a made dish>
2 : assured of success <a made man> -- usually used in the phrase have it made
1 : to bring into existence <God created the heaven and the earth -- Gen 1:1 (Authorized Version)>
2 a : to invest with a new form, office, or rank <was created a lieutenant> b : to produce or bring about by a course of action or behavior <her arrival created a terrible fuss> <create new jobs>
3 : CAUSE, OCCASION <famine creates high food prices>
4 a : to produce through imaginative skill <create a painting> b : DESIGN <creates dresses>
intransitive senses : to make or bring into existence something new
theres almost too much stuff to pick apart there...
once again you didnt really state anything. at best, i can say is to be agnostic. but i just lean towards science because its actual meat and potatoes, no smoke screens know what i mean.
Last edited by whitey; 03-29-2006 at 02:02 AM.
The earth is a very small stage in a vast cosmic arena. Think of the rivers of blood spilled by all those generals and emperors so that in glory and in triumph they could become the momentary masters of a fraction of a dot.
People are too stupid to effectively conspire to do anything, but not too stupid to come up with conspiracy theories.
im saying because we came from single cell creatures it doesnt mean there was a creator. there is no proof other than people saying we HAD to come from something higher than us. and there is just no logical basis for that.
i would fully agree there is plenty of debate on the topic of RNA and how those first cells actually came to be. but it doesnt mean it must automatically be a god, and i see no good reason that it would be. nothing on earth has proved anything of the sort.
The earth is a very small stage in a vast cosmic arena. Think of the rivers of blood spilled by all those generals and emperors so that in glory and in triumph they could become the momentary masters of a fraction of a dot.
People are too stupid to effectively conspire to do anything, but not too stupid to come up with conspiracy theories.
made is usually used when you talk about creation "humans, animals, ....". and create is for god but in certain situations it used for humans. but the creativity of humans ain't something that match the creativity of god.
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