"It's all right to hate, as long as you hate what God hates and love what God loves"

[whitey]

2. What irks me are people who don't actually know what they're talking about, talking about it. "a time way long ago" - when was that? Sounds like you're talking Star Wars. And the point remains, if we go from point A to point B, where point A is 'no science' = disbelief in God and point B is 'science' = belief in God, then there is a continuity...a linear progression. So for science to be introduced (to save us all ), someone at some point had to suddenly 'get smart', when everyone around them was ignorant. This thesis makes no logical sense.

A long time ago, means a long fucking time ago. 15,000 years and more. When an early human saw lightining being shot down from the sky, What the hell are they supposed to think? O wait, because science has always been around and people of 15,000 ago and more were certainly on the same level as us they immedialty thought .... Lightning is a powerful natural electrostatic discharge produced during a thunderstorm. This abrupt electric discharge is accompanied by the emission of visible light and other forms of electromagnetic radiation. The electruc current passing through the discharge channels rapidly heats and expands the air into plasma, producing acoustic shock waves (thunder) in the atmosphere......Are you fucking serious?

By the time something like that (and many other scientific discoveries) had happened religion had already been intreched in society. Too many people had already accepted it as a staple of their lives. Once its there is very hard to get out.

[whitey]

^ I just disagree. Humans are curious by nature. They have a brain and they tried to used it. Back then what else would they think.

They would try and attribute something to it. Same thing with fire and rain and numerous other happenings in nature. Thats why almost all ancient civilizations thought there was a god for all that stuff. They didn't know any better, they didnt know that these were just natural phenomena explained by certain natural processes. They thought something biggerhad to be causing it. And since they didn't know any better they attributed it to something more powerful than man. A concept of a god was born. And its been with us ever since. Of course it ment different things to different people, and turned into different things from different people. Hence islam was started by certain peoples and its practiced mainly by the same peoples today. Same with chrisitanity, and hinduism, and buddism, and jewdaism. They all basically are saying the same thing, but came from different peoples, with different cultures which explains difference among the religions. But basically they are all the same.

A similair way I may try and explain what i mean is when you look at african americans today in the United States. Why do a lot of them act the way the do? There is not essentially somethign wrong with them that makes them commit more crime, do worse in school ect. ect. It is because of the way they were brought here and treated therafter that has affected them and had such lasting affects. Now this is a rather blanket statment because I am by no means am infering that all blacks americans are like this, because its not at all the case. There have been many that have broken the chain and are succseful people. But with a lot of them, like people who maintain this believe in religions and god, its something that has happend long ago and the effects are just still being seen. Its hard to break the cycle. Once it was started long ago with humans and religion it was just perpetuated, the same with the state of many africans in this country.

[Urban_Journalz]

You know, if God didn't hate fags, Sodom & Gomorrah would still be standing. And if any of you bitches want your beloved SCIENTIFIC EVIDENCE that this place DID exist and he ruins ARE still around...go to www.arkdiscovery.com that is.....if you're not too much a punk to do so. Juevos???

[whitey]

You know, if God didn't hate fags, Sodom & Gomorrah would still be standing. And if any of you bitches want your beloved SCIENTIFIC EVIDENCE that this place DID exist and he ruins ARE still around...go to www.arkdiscovery.com that is.....if you're not too much a punk to do so. Juevos???

its a joke of a post. what would god really give a shit if people were gay? hes god.

[Wamukota X]

of course it existed.. we just didnt have any evidence or proof to believe it existed!

and thats exactly the point!

its totally possible that a god is indeed keeping the planets in order, but unless u can offer some evidence or proof to back up this claim, its worthless

just like it would be worthless to talk about dna before it was discovered

This thread was not intended to question the existence of God but I see it has taken that route. By you own statements you are saying just because man cannot validate the fact that God is keeping the planets in orbit then the thought of God is worthless. There is tons of scientific explainations that have not yet been reveal to this current society. So are you saying you base all you beliefs on scientific evidence. A few years ago over 90% of the "test" in the
New England Journal of Medicine were found inconclusive. That says alot about todays and yesterdays scientific methods.

[Koolish]

the main issue with you people reading these things is that you're misinterpreting them. did you know that many historians believe that plato was gay because he always professed "love" for his students? love is a strong word used today, and it's the same with hate.

to hate something doesn't mean you must wish all bad upon them, but the things you are to hate are things you are to not like. that's it, don't like them. hate today is a very strong word.

[whitey]

the main issue with you people reading these things is that you're misinterpreting them. did you know that many historians believe that plato was gay because he always professed "love" for his students? love is a strong word used today, and it's the same with hate.

to hate something doesn't mean you must wish all bad upon them, but the things you are to hate are things you are to not like. that's it, don't like them. hate today is a very strong word.

I think it had more to do with the homosexual relations he had with males of his time.

[My First Timbs]

This thread was not intended to question the existence of God but I see it has taken that route. By you own statements you are saying just because man cannot validate the fact that God is keeping the planets in orbit then the thought of God is worthless. There is tons of scientific explainations that have not yet been reveal to this current society. So are you saying you base all you beliefs on scientific evidence. A few years ago over 90% of the "test" in the
New England Journal of Medicine were found inconclusive. That says alot about todays and yesterdays scientific methods.

what im saying and said is that if u have no rational reason or basis to belive something and u still believe it, just realize that its an irrational belief that has no merit.

i could believe right now that there is an invisible pink unicorn under my bed! are u to take this claim seriously without any evidence to back it up? of course not! its an irrational claim!

i base all beliefs on what th evidence dictates! this is the power and burden of free thought.. the evidence dictates what to believe.........

in similar token, it may possibly (but we all know its highly unlikely) that there are indeed invisible unicorns who live under ppl's beds.. but until that is proven, i will side with reason and not believe in invisible unicorns....

[Iron Fist]

For all those who only base their beliefs on scientific explanations, I must admit that not every phenomenon is explanable. Just like God many things happening on earth cannot be proved. For example, nobody was able to provide a proper explanations of what happened at Point Pleasant in 1966 (please read). How can you explain the presence of the Mothman ? How is that possible ? If you only base your beliefs on scientific explanations, you would not believe this is true, cause it's unexplanable. Just like the presence of God for atheists, I believe. There are many other supernatural phenomenons that happen on earth, like people seeing ghosts or spirits, and I think it is linked to the presence of God in some way.

I've read on the net that atheists believe there was no beginning, is that true ?

[Iron Fist]

I read something on internet and I find it very interresting:

"If we know the creation has a beginning, we are faced with another logical question_was the creation caused or was it not caused? The Bible states, "In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth." Not only does the Bible maintain that there was a cause_a creation_but it also tells us what the cause was. It was God. The atheist tells us that "matter is self-existing and not created." If matter had a beginning and yet was uncaused, one must logically maintain that something would have had to come into existence out of nothing. From empty space with no force, no matter, no energy, and no intelligence, matter would have to become existent. Even if this could happen by some strange new process unknown to science today, there is a logical problem.
In order for matter to come out of nothing, all of our scientific laws dealing with the conservation of matter/energy would have to be wrong, invalidating all of chemistry. All of our laws of conservation of angular momentum would have to be wrong, invalidating all of physics. All of our laws of conservation of electric charge would have to be wrong, invalidating all of electronics and demanding that your TV set not work!! Your television set may not work, but that is not the reason! In order to believe matter is uncaused, one has to discard known laws and principles of science. No reasonable person is going to do this simply to maintain a personal atheistic position.
The atheist's assertion that matter is eternal is wrong. The atheist's assertion that the universe is uncaused and selfexisting is also incorrect The Bible's assertion that there was a beginning which was caused is supported strongly by the available scientific evidence."

[Iron Fist]

For more "proof" about the presence of God, which you may call valid or not, read this page:

http://www.doesgodexist.org/Phamplets/Mansproof.html

[Koolish]

I think it had more to do with the homosexual relations he had with males of his time.

see, you just proved my point.

and i can see this post is about why the Bible is wrong if "hate" is used in this book of "good". the Bible is reality, it's a largely historical book. if you want to show real people who do not express hate for something then they are not human. when it referenced God hating something, it told the israelites don't do this shit because it's not good for you.

you also have to take into account TRANSLATION!!!!!! when this is being translated the translator will use the word in english that best represents what is being said in ancient hebrew/greek/latin whatever. until we know what is being said in the original version we can't come to perfect conclusions.

people used words differently ages ago, and i think it's Greek where there are numerous different words for "love", while we have only one. just an example of how English isn't the master language that can perfectly represent all others.

[My First Timbs]

I read something on internet and I find it very interresting:

"If we know the creation has a beginning, we are faced with another logical question_was the creation caused or was it not caused? The Bible states, "In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth." Not only does the Bible maintain that there was a cause_a creation_but it also tells us what the cause was. It was God. The atheist tells us that "matter is self-existing and not created." If matter had a beginning and yet was uncaused, one must logically maintain that something would have had to come into existence out of nothing. From empty space with no force, no matter, no energy, and no intelligence, matter would have to become existent. Even if this could happen by some strange new process unknown to science today, there is a logical problem.
In order for matter to come out of nothing, all of our scientific laws dealing with the conservation of matter/energy would have to be wrong, invalidating all of chemistry. All of our laws of conservation of angular momentum would have to be wrong, invalidating all of physics. All of our laws of conservation of electric charge would have to be wrong, invalidating all of electronics and demanding that your TV set not work!! Your television set may not work, but that is not the reason! In order to believe matter is uncaused, one has to discard known laws and principles of science. No reasonable person is going to do this simply to maintain a personal atheistic position.
The atheist's assertion that matter is eternal is wrong. The atheist's assertion that the universe is uncaused and selfexisting is also incorrect The Bible's assertion that there was a beginning which was caused is supported strongly by the available scientific evidence."

ahh .. u bring up what is known formally as the "first cause postulate"

1) everything in existence does not have to have a cause! (this is where the claim first goes wrong).. it assumes all things that exist have a cuase (this is not necessarily so and has been demonstrated by advances in quantum mechanics)

2) the word "cause" is a sly attempt at intelligent design.. cause sneakily implies design.. design sneakily implies purpose.. purpose sneakily implies a designer.

3) the laws of conservation of energy did not apply until te system was created.. meaning, until a fraction of a second after the big bang.. so its irrational to apply a concept as such to creation...... its invalid

4) i dont know where u got that from, but ive never heard an athistic argument that all matter is "eternal".. absurd misrepresenttion of the athiestic position

[My First Timbs]

For more "proof" about the presence of God, which you may call valid or not, read this page:

http://www.doesgodexist.org/Phamplets/Mansproof.html

im glad u put quotation marks around "proof"

[Iron Fist]

im glad u put quotation marks around "proof"

Well it meant that I did not know whether it was valid or not.