The 'We are Just Animals' Perspective

[CherChezLaMarauder]

Well it's not like I'll be around to see or hear being remembered, buy hey it's pretty cool don't you think? Maybe I'll go back to The Bronx, kill all the dope dealers and take over their clientelle and run the streets. Then put 12 ghetto children thru college. Then some sexy mami will set me up and I'll be murdered while my head is leaning back getting a blow job. After the funeral they'll spray paint my potrait on the side of bodega on The Grand Concourse saying R.I.P. Marauder, you'll be missed

=P

[My First Timbs]

i thought evolution was about change?

and survival is what happens when things adjust to their environment

where are all the words like 'temporarily' in your post?

are animals not still physically evolving?

here is what ppl miss and is cause for much confusion.

u have to realize that evolution is th emost all encompassing scientific discipline there is next to physics.

evolution has everything to do with a bunch of different complex topics

evolution has everything to do with change

but more importantly, that change is only due to what traits/phenotypes and genotypic frequencies are most successful.....this in turn means that evolution has all to do with change and reproductive success....but it doesnt stop there.... reproductive success has everything to do with ecology.. so evolution has everything to do with

change
reproductive success
ecology

but it doesnt end there.... ecology is firmly grounded in a carload of other chemial and biological disciplines!

u get the idea

so to simply state that " i thought evolution was only about change".. u are commiting a critical error that will not allow u to fully understand and see evolution for what it is.

[LHX]

here is what ppl miss and is cause for much confusion.

u have to realize that evolution is th emost all encompassing scientific discipline there is next to physics.

evolution has everything to do with a bunch of different complex topics

evolution has everything to do with change

but more importantly, that change is only due to what traits/phenotypes and genotypic frequencies are most successful.....this in turn means that evolution has all to do with change and reproductive success....but it doesnt stop there.... reproductive success has everything to do with ecology.. so evolution has everything to do with

change
reproductive success
ecology

but it doesnt end there.... ecology is firmly grounded in a carload of other chemial and biological disciplines!

u get the idea

so to simply state that " i thought evolution was only about change".. u are commiting a critical error that will not allow u to fully understand and see evolution for what it is.

Timbs, please demonstrate where in my post I said 'evolution is only about change'?

also:
all the other aspects you mentioned seem to fit under the umbrella of investigating the intricacies of change

[GENERAL WISE]

THE WU-TANG CALN IS COMMIN THRU THE OUTCOME IS CRITIC'AL
FUCKING WITH MY STYLE IS SORTA LIKE A MIRAC'AL
THE OLD' School ASkjbkjfnbhdkajhdkjahklfdhalkdshdlfj

FREE POST YEAH

Humans = not special = we are animals= God did not make us from his image
You lost as well as I and all of humanity who thinks that they are especial...

[LHX]

one more thing:

but more importantly, that change is only due to what traits/phenotypes and genotypic frequencies are most successful.....

is it not true that the 'success' of a trait can change in the blink of an eye?

this is one of the areas where the practicality of these scientific disciplines fall apart, nor do they admit that many of these findings are nothing more than common sense when reduced to their most basic form



is it really a stunning revelation to state that adapting to the environment is a matter of having 'successful' habits?

[whitey]

depending on the enviornment. other animals, the climate, maybe advance of a certain desease things do change. certain earthly phenomenon like earthquakes, sunamis, volcanos, meterors ect. but people dont look at it like that.

they only look at the here and now and dont see how 99% of all species that have lived on this earth are extinct. its a 4 billion year old process that has a couple billion more to go.

[june181972]

here is what ppl miss and is cause for much confusion.

u have to realize that evolution is th emost all encompassing scientific discipline there is next to physics. this statement is highly suspect, and cleverly vague (see next reponse in white)

evolution has everything to do with a bunch of different complex topics
when trying to answer any "complex" scientific question, one has to incorporate multiple disciplines and sub-disciplines
science or no science, things are only as complex as one choses to make them

evolution has everything to do with change
everything, anything that happens is subject to what?
TIME
Time never ever stops changing, "the continuum of Time"
and Time brings about any and all change
what makes evolution's relationship to Time different from any other entity?

but more importantly, that change is only due to what traits/phenotypes and genotypic frequencies are most successful.....this in turn means that evolution has all to do with change and reproductive success....but it doesnt stop there.... reproductive success has everything to do with ecology.. so evolution has everything to do with
as far as reproductive success goes
humans spend the longest amount of Time in utero
and take the longest amount of Time to become fully grown from birth (or conception for that matter)
just another distinguishing quality of humans

change
reproductive success
ecology

but it doesnt end there.... ecology is firmly grounded in a carload of other chemial and biological disciplines!
"all encompassing???"

u get the idea

so to simply state that " i thought evolution was only about change".. u are commiting a critical error that will not allow u to fully understand and see evolution for what it is.

after all of this posting, now you want imply that the thread subject is too complex for the laymen to understand?

[Aqueous Moon]

nah - its not a matter of bracing yourself really

its just me trying to define that which cannot be defined

this spawns an interesting discussion tho:

regarding purpose


without a clearly defined purpose - most people fall apart

yet there is nobody who can explain their purpose and defend it without sounding like they are a member of a cult

strange?

It's a conspiracy....it's supposed to sound strange.

If you live in a sick society and you are considered well-adjusted, does that mean that you are sick?

And, what does it mean when a sick society considers you crazy or cult?

[LHX]

It's a conspiracy....it's supposed to sound strange.

If you live in a sick society and you are considered well-adjusted, does that mean that you are sick?

And, what does it mean when a sick society considers you crazy or cult?

i agree with everything you typed

but it still does not mean that it is easy for us to agree on 'Truth'


we agreed in the past that this process was set into motion because the 'original man' was unsatisfied, and that what we are experiencing is the process of becoming satisfied

putting this into different terms, what is the difference between now and before? what do we have now which is becoming satisfied that we did not have before?

everything seems to point to symbols and words

symbols and words are powerful, and they are the tool thru which all trick-knowledge is expressed and manifested

it seems that the purpose of this 'life' is to understand the power of symbols and words, and to be able to use them responsibly

this may seem like nonsense because we were all brought up in a society where people shoot their mouths off without thinking twice, but it may not be as ridiculous as it seems

in the search for 'purpose', most people look for something dramatic that provides an obvious sense of fulfillment (save the environment, stop the violence, etc etc), but if you trace all of these things back to their ORIGINAL SOURCE -- the SOURCE OF ALL PROBLEMS, it seems that you will find that all things bad are due to the fact that false words are spoken, and thru this, it is possible to send people moving in the wrong direction

---and to tie this back to the topic of this thread - our animal 'brethren' are not currently in the same process

we are not 'just' animals

we have the bodies of animals, but clearly we are also something else

something else completely

[My First Timbs]

Timbs, please demonstrate where in my post I said 'evolution is only about change'?

also:
all the other aspects you mentioned seem to fit under the umbrella of investigating the intricacies of change

in your last post (which was a rebuttal of a post i think from whitey)

u stated

Originally Posted by LHX
i thought evolution was about change?

and survival is what happens when things adjust to their environment

from this post (being that it was a rebuttal of another post).. it implied to me that you were arguing that evolution wasnt about success and survival, but rather simply "change"

was i wrong in what u were implying?

[Aqueous Moon]

I see what you are saying, LHX...

Why was the Original man un-satisfied? Zig Zag Zig/ knowledge wisdom understanding

Knowledge comes first but, it is not in the form of understanding. In order to get to understanding from knowledge you have to go through wisdom.

Wisdom is wise words being spoken, this is mos def what you are building off when you speak about the importance of symbols and words. Wisdom is also wise ways and actions. Wisdom reflects self.

Since the Original man started out with knowledge, he had to defragment his knowledge into the form of wisdom so that he could bring about understanding by showing and proving. This was his purpose.

So, what do we have now that we didn't have before? We now have proof of the Truth....or proof of knowledge.

We need to remember that Wisdom (words and symbols) are only reflections of the knowledge that was already planted from the very beginning.

In this context, realize that the reflection is not greater than it's source. It can become equal to it. But, it will never be the same as the foundation it stemmed from.

To bring about Trick-knowledge, you have to know and hide the Original knowledge, first.

My point being basically, nothing is new under the Sun. That portion of the Original Man in his state of un-satisfaction certainly had words and symbols. His ability to make trick knowledge and teach it attends to this.

The supreme understanding of knowledge in addition to wisdom is most def purpose.

Also, some human beings do come in animal form. But, not all of them. I am not speaking meaphorically when I say that.

[My First Timbs]

also:
all the other aspects you mentioned seem to fit under the umbrella of investigating the intricacies of change

well with that mindset anything and everything in the universe we live in can be mootly argued to simply be a component of change! being that we reside in a continuum of space and time.. but that of course is a weak point.. of course, time progresses in everything and inevitably everything will be affected by time's progressionand inevitable change.

that wasnt what the issue was about... the issue as i perceived it (and please let me know if im wrong in how i perceived it) was rather simply about what evolution is about and what major components are crucial for its understanding.

i was pointing out how in the scheme of things (scientifically that is) evolution is at the top of a pyramid, and it is firmly grounded and based on a host of other disciplines and phenomenon.... thus any sentence that implies that "i thought evolution was about ________" is critically flawed unless the sentence starts with "i thought evolution was about ______ and ___ _and ___ and ___ and ____ and ________"

[My First Timbs]

one more thing:



is it not true that the 'success' of a trait can change in the blink of an eye?

this is one of the areas where the practicality of these scientific disciplines fall apart, nor do they admit that many of these findings are nothing more than common sense when reduced to their most basic form



is it really a stunning revelation to state that adapting to the environment is a matter of having 'successful' habits?

of course the success of a trait can change in the blink of an eye... a uccessful triat in one environment can be detrimental in another... a successful trait or gentypic frequency that occurs in one time period, could be a cause for extinction in another)

i dont c how that presents a problem to modern science? thats crucial to the understanding of how selection works.

[My First Timbs]

after all of this posting, now you want imply that the thread subject is too complex for the laymen to understand

u are fundamentally missing my point

i never once stated nor did i imply that it is too complex for a layman.. im simply pointing out that evolution cant be viewed in a vacuum without taking into account the other disciplines which it is grounded in. i dont c how that is not understood?

u cant understand evolution if u dont have a firm understanding of genetics .. u cant understand genetics if u dont understand molecular biology... u dont get the entirty of molecular biology unless u have a firm grasp on organic chemistry.. so on and so on.....

thats all i was merely pointing out.... is there a problem with that statement?

[LHX]

The supreme understanding of knowledge in addition to wisdom is most def purpose.

i follow you, but can you translate that into english?

the original man did communicate, but he didnt have symbols, words and lies.

there was no phonetic alphabet


this is the outcome