Religion... And Its Meaning

[LHX]

In contrast, the God fearing peoples of say Medieval Islam, made an obligation to study the sciences of life, and they progressed greatly inspiring the european renaissance. I think the point you make has some interesting issues we should deal with, but one who understands the majesty of the creator will seek to find, no?

PEACE

in all honesty

i find your response to be absolutely reasonable and respectable

i would look forward to building with you in the future as it is apparent that our perspectives are much more similar than they are different - but there is some significance in the differences

My arguement is that there is only one GOD. Not in any other other context, such as within, without, external, internal. But one GOD who Created man, because He said so! Therefore if you say your familiar with 99 names, you would see the complexity of creation and not make statements dangerous to your "self".

i tend to agree

but as there is only one, then the technique of 'creating' also suggests creating from self

and thus
anything created is a manifestation of that which created it

and
endowed with the same opportunity to be aligned with the same intelligence, the 'creation' can be on the same level of that which created it


are you familiar with fractals?

the way things get get created over and over and over again on different levels?

within the mind of each individual man is the capacity for entire universes (multiverses) the same way we are in the universe that 'the creator' 'made' for us


we may have been created by 'the one thing that said so', but we are also part of 'the one thing that said so' and have all the properties of 'the one thing that said so'


even you can say so

[MsRzaRecTaH]

Yo LHX.. are you on MSN right now??

[Urban_Journalz]

its not a matter of liking it or disliking it
its a matter of calling nonsense nonsense


LHX-42:7 "He calleth bullshit wherever it may appeareth, and seeks not to duck away from those crafty in speech, who would have the people settle for something lessereth than what they areth"


and i dont oppose the most high

i spend every breath seeking to understand him/it better and i understand enuf not to sell myself short



lmfao

my challenge still stands

lets finish dismantling this society
lets find heaven
and THEN i will listen to you tell me what i can and cannot do



i dont see what is scary about complete submission to something bigger than you

its reassuring

it also makes you not afraid to be attacked and persecuted in the court of public perception


its on you if you are afraid to accept the responsibility for everything there is, has been, or will be



its definitely not possible for somebody with your mentality

you can create 47 universes in the time it takes to excrete your morning shit



i agree


swing and a miss

you can create things that endure


you doubt my ability to 'snatch something from a fly'

i put it on you to provide a visual demonstration of these '3 worlds' and something travelling thru them


you trying to convince the forum? or yourself?

Calling nonsense nonsense? Yet you say you try to understand God, while at the same time make a blatant mockery of Scripture and those who follow it. You don't spend every breath seeking to understand Him, all you do is find ways to disagree with the answers that are already set forth for those willing to find them, due to the fact that you yourself are unable to do so. Either by choice, or by birth.

Finish dismantling society? Find Heaven? I'd love to know where that came from and is leading to. Sounds like more empty words to me.

There isn't anything scary about submission to The Creator. I'd love to know where I said that. Since you brought up the fact that there's nothing wrong with it and it's reassuring, where do you get your mockery of scriptures from and your claims that you can do what God does?? It's on you if you're not willing to accept responsibility for everything that was, has been and will be?? That makes NO sense. All you're responsible for is what you do. Period. You make absolutely no sense whatsoever. If that statement were to make any sense, it would have to say that you're responsible for what you know and how you use it, in which case, you'd be speaking as one who believes, instead of yet another who merely asks questions instead of genuinely seeking the Truth. So, I'd try to figure out what I was trying to say, instead of talking for the sake of talking because I'm wondering just how many squirrels are running loose in your attic about now. It's either a bruise on the brain or hypocrisy at work. Afraid to accept responsibility? I'd believe that one who would rather guess and ask profoundly stupid questions while coming up with their own "philosophies" is more afraid to accept responsibilities for their actions than one who practices their doctrine diligently.

Not possible for someone with my mentality?? And I suppose it's possible for someone with yours, right?? Since you seem to be hung up on
'imagination', pay attention; you are a creation. Like it or not, that's the way it is. You can talk for as long as your whims will give you strength to do so, because all you can do is talk. Your challenge still stands?? So does the one in The Qur'an and in 1500 years, not a livin' ass has been able to meet it. Not just the one that Rah quoted, but another that read, "O mankind and Jinni! If you have power to penetrate all reaches of The Heavens, then penetrate them!" So you putting on the air of, "because I think I can" in this case is nothing new. All that's ever happened is lip service, just like now. My statement stands as the proven truth because of that fact. So you can use what language you will, all you'll ever show is who you really are.

We as humans can create things that endure, but none of us can create things that endure forever. Savvy?

No, I don't doubt your ability to snatch something from a fly, I flat out deny the existence of such ability. As for your 'putting it on me to provide a visual demonstration', the 3 worlds, since this also seems to have escaped you, are, AGAIN, the world we humans dwell in, the space between sky and soil, the world benath the soil where worms, bacteria and other life thives, and the world under the ocean. You want a visual, go watch The Discovery Channel.

Trying to convince the forum or myself?? That only means am I trying to convince YOU, in which case I'll say again, stop overestimating your importance. I don't have to convince anyone because that's not my job, nor am I, unlike you, trying to make everyone believe that I'm right. My points have the gift of being how I feel, plus making sense. I couldn't care less how you feel or what you 'believe' or 'agree' to. I make my points for me. You may have a fetish for typing for the sake of having other people read what you say, which is clear from the contradictions in your posts, but I actually LIVE what I say. Savvy?? So don't think I have anything in common with you other than the fact that we breathe the same air.

[Frontal Lobotomy]

In British law (not sure if it applies everywhere) Any following that has more than 10,000 members can officially be declared a religion. My example being in the last sensus, more than 10,000 people said their religion was 'jedi' and thus Jedi should've been classed as a religion. The powers that be didn't feel the same way and just considered it facetious.

[Os3y3ris]

To what end?? You make it sound as if He needs us to believe in him. The power of God is manifested in everything seen and unseen. Known and unknown. Creation is the foundation of all of the above mentioned fields. This is where belief and disbelief begin to manifest as well, apparently.

Our belief is required for creation to have any relevance. If we don't believe it and eliminate knowledge of it from our senses, than in what way does it affect us? It doesn't.

One thing is certain, all the people who thrive on "what ifs", I'd pay good money to see their faces when death approaches because with such care-free and pseudo-philosophical convictions ans beliefs, they shouldn't be afraid of a damn thing at that point.

Living forever is a far scarier concept than dying. I've tried both.

this forum used to be quite intellectual...now we are reduced to statements like this...if youve got a point to make about GOD, try and bring some evidence, otherwise your just a donkey carrying words

Do more/better drugs man. They'll remind you of the truth in what I say.

[LHX]

Calling nonsense nonsense? Yet you say you try to understand God, while at the same time make a blatant mockery of Scripture and those who follow it. You don't spend every breath seeking to understand Him, all you do is find ways to disagree with the answers that are already set forth for those willing to find them, due to the fact that you yourself are unable to do so. Either by choice, or by birth.

Finish dismantling society? Find Heaven? I'd love to know where that came from and is leading to. Sounds like more empty words to me.

There isn't anything scary about submission to The Creator. I'd love to know where I said that. Since you brought up the fact that there's nothing wrong with it and it's reassuring, where do you get your mockery of scriptures from and your claims that you can do what God does?? It's on you if you're not willing to accept responsibility for everything that was, has been and will be?? That makes NO sense. All you're responsible for is what you do. Period. You make absolutely no sense whatsoever. If that statement were to make any sense, it would have to say that you're responsible for what you know and how you use it, in which case, you'd be speaking as one who believes, instead of yet another who merely asks questions instead of genuinely seeking the Truth. So, I'd try to figure out what I was trying to say, instead of talking for the sake of talking because I'm wondering just how many squirrels are running loose in your attic about now. It's either a bruise on the brain or hypocrisy at work. Afraid to accept responsibility? I'd believe that one who would rather guess and ask profoundly stupid questions while coming up with their own "philosophies" is more afraid to accept responsibilities for their actions than one who practices their doctrine diligently.

Not possible for someone with my mentality?? And I suppose it's possible for someone with yours, right?? Since you seem to be hung up on
'imagination', pay attention; you are a creation. Like it or not, that's the way it is. You can talk for as long as your whims will give you strength to do so, because all you can do is talk. Your challenge still stands?? So does the one in The Qur'an and in 1500 years, not a livin' ass has been able to meet it. Not just the one that Rah quoted, but another that read, "O mankind and Jinni! If you have power to penetrate all reaches of The Heavens, then penetrate them!" So you putting on the air of, "because I think I can" in this case is nothing new. All that's ever happened is lip service, just like now. My statement stands as the proven truth because of that fact. So you can use what language you will, all you'll ever show is who you really are.

We as humans can create things that endure, but none of us can create things that endure forever. Savvy?

No, I don't doubt your ability to snatch something from a fly, I flat out deny the existence of such ability. As for your 'putting it on me to provide a visual demonstration', the 3 worlds, since this also seems to have escaped you, are, AGAIN, the world we humans dwell in, the space between sky and soil, the world benath the soil where worms, bacteria and other life thives, and the world under the ocean. You want a visual, go watch The Discovery Channel.

Trying to convince the forum or myself?? That only means am I trying to convince YOU, in which case I'll say again, stop overestimating your importance. I don't have to convince anyone because that's not my job, nor am I, unlike you, trying to make everyone believe that I'm right. My points have the gift of being how I feel, plus making sense. I couldn't care less how you feel or what you 'believe' or 'agree' to. I make my points for me. You may have a fetish for typing for the sake of having other people read what you say, which is clear from the contradictions in your posts, but I actually LIVE what I say. Savvy?? So don't think I have anything in common with you other than the fact that we breathe the same air.

briefly:
1. youre mean and prolly not too friendly
2. 1500 years is not a long time in the scope of infinity
3. the scriptures were written by... people? and are subject to... everything that goes along with that? (critical thinking Shropsher - try it out)
4. sorry i didnt understand '3 worlds' in the Shropsher vernacular (Three Worlds according to wikipedia)
5. what is wrong with mocking scripture? isnt that what its there for? to be scrutinized / tested / refined?
6. if my words are empty, at least i keep them brief and easy on the eyes (i am that considerate)
7. if the answers are already set forth, then what are you even discussing? why would you waste your time? my hunch is that you are still piecing things together (which is ok - we all are), and there is something redeeming you are getting from this discussion
8. maybe my 'philosophies' sound 'stupid' to you because i have dared to keep a open mind?

Peace

[Urban_Journalz]

Our belief is required for creation to have any relevance. If we don't believe it and eliminate knowledge of it from our senses, than in what way does it affect us? It doesn't.



Living forever is a far scarier concept than dying. I've tried both.

Our belief doesn't enter into it. If that were so, a lot of things wouldn't be possible. Wether we believe or not doesn't change a thing in the grand scheme of things, all it does is make the non-believer a bit more comfortable. Since the majority of the world is like this and normally what's popular is usually unhealthy, I'll stick to what I believe.

Immortality isn't possible at this stage of existence and I'm glad. Anyone who would want to live here forever has my sympathy.

[Civilison]

Do more/better drugs man. They'll remind you of the truth in what I say.

lmao

i do get your point... some people maybe can't relate tho.

[Urban_Journalz]

briefly:
1. youre mean and prolly not too friendly
2. 1500 years is not a long time in the scope of infinity
3. the scriptures were written by... people? and are subject to... everything that goes along with that? (critical thinking Shropsher - try it out)
4. sorry i didnt understand '3 worlds' in the Shropsher vernacular (Three Worlds according to wikipedia)
5. what is wrong with mocking scripture? isnt that what its there for? to be scrutinized / tested / refined?
6. if my words are empty, at least i keep them brief and easy on the eyes (i am that considerate)
7. if the answers are already set forth, then what are you even discussing? why would you waste your time? my hunch is that you are still piecing things together (which is ok - we all are), and there is something redeeming you are getting from this discussion
8. maybe my 'philosophies' sound 'stupid' to you because i have dared to keep a open mind?

Peace

You say I'm mean, I say I'm serious. So whatever to that.

Yeah, 1500 years isn't a long time compared to eternity, that still doesn't leave out the fact that no one has met the challenge and all that's occured is the easiest thing possible, talking.

You assume that the scriptures were written by people and assumptions are just as dangerous as any other form guessing without adequate research. The newer versions of The Torah and Gospel were re-written. The original versions were not written by people. But then, you'd have to have faith to grasp that. The Qur'an is the only book that hasn't been changed since it's revelation. Since you're so fond of calling bluffs, call this one. Go try to find a single copy that isn't like another. Give me one chapter and verse that differs from the same numbered in another copy. Tell yourself to try critical thinking. I'm not the one who contradicts myself in my own posts. There's a fine line between critical thinking and trying to tell someone that the earth is flat. Wrap your mind around that one.

What's wrong with mocking scripture you say? Isn't it there to be scrutinized/ tested/refined? This is a clear-cut case of how much you don't know. To answer your question, if you can even call it that, NO. Scriptures are rules. Savvy? Law. Set forth to maintain order. You wouldn't need LAW if you weren't LAWLESS and contrary to popular and childish belief, their set forth for the positive develpoment of mankind. Too many people are brats in this case though, because they think any and all rules are meant to be questioned, taunted, bent and broken habitually. Their meant to be followed, just like the laws set forth by your government, that I'm sure you're much more willing to follow, are set forth to maintain a certain order. All you do when you mock scripture is jump on the bandwagon of the thousands if not millions of other people who do the same thing. It doesn't matter what the new generations do, what was written was written. Men change the words to suite their own fancies and it's always short-lived. Your vision of The Scripture's purpose is born from what you see other people doing to and with it, not from what it's actual purpose is. Try thinking for yourself along with that 'critical thinking' method you mentioned.

So, the fact that your words are short makes up for the fact that their empty. Do you think about these things before you type, or do you just start typing?? Considerate? Hey, if people don't want to read, they won't read. I don't really stop and ask myself, "Self, what if the amount of words in my post scares those less inclined to read away from what I type?" so it makes me no difference.

Yes, the answers are set forth. I'm typing because it's an open thread and I felt like touching on the subject. The only thing truly redeeming about all of this is seeing how many hilarious conclusions people can come up with.

Dared to keep an open mind?? No, you've dared to come up with conclusions that have no factual backing except, "It could happen".

Don't forget, I wasn't talking to you to begin with, you approached me and not even in a decent manner. So again, if I seem mean, perhaps you should think about how you approach people before you apporach them.

[Esquire]

Something that give's you hope, some ppl need something to hold on to, the world can be a cold/cold place.

[Os3y3ris]

Our belief doesn't enter into it. If that were so, a lot of things wouldn't be possible. Wether we believe or not doesn't change a thing in the grand scheme of things, all it does is make the non-believer a bit more comfortable.

In consensus reality, you'd be correct. However, we don't spend all our time there. Also, consensus changes.

Immortality isn't possible at this stage.

Sure it is. Time is a function of the mind, nothing else. When you take responsibility for the concept of forever, there's no reason why you couldn't live forever.

[LHX]

You say I'm mean, I say I'm serious. So whatever to that.

if you speak soft, you can still preserve the friendship

i will never turn my back on you

Yeah, 1500 years isn't a long time compared to eternity, that still doesn't leave out the fact that no one has met the challenge and all that's occured is the easiest thing possible, talking.

not only is 1500 years not a long time
but
its a really short amount of time

You assume that the scriptures were written by people and assumptions are just as dangerous as any other form guessing without adequate research. The newer versions of The Torah and Gospel were re-written. The original versions were not written by people.

now youre theory is on thin ice

But then, you'd have to have faith to grasp that.

and the ice just broke

The Qur'an is the only book that hasn't been changed since it's revelation. Since you're so fond of calling bluffs, call this one. Go try to find a single copy that isn't like another. Give me one chapter and verse that differs from the same numbered in another copy. Tell yourself to try critical thinking. I'm not the one who contradicts myself in my own posts. There's a fine line between critical thinking and trying to tell someone that the earth is flat. Wrap your mind around that one.

the surface of the earth is flat

what language should i look for it in?

What's wrong with mocking scripture you say? Isn't it there to be scrutinized/ tested/refined? This is a clear-cut case of how much you don't know. To answer your question, if you can even call it that, NO. Scriptures are rules. Savvy? Law. Set forth to maintain order. You wouldn't need LAW if you weren't LAWLESS and contrary to popular and childish belief, their set forth for the positive develpoment of mankind. Too many people are brats in this case though, because they think any and all rules are meant to be questioned, taunted, bent and broken habitually.

laws?
rules?

laws of physics cannot be broken - we already have those

what other laws are there?

books give people suggestions and things to consider

they give warnings

some scriptures try to scare people into acting a certain way

Their meant to be followed, just like the laws set forth by your government, that I'm sure you're much more willing to follow, are set forth to maintain a certain order.

not a good assumption

All you do when you mock scripture is jump on the bandwagon of the thousands if not millions of other people who do the same thing.

and why dont you appear in the threads where i defend all the virtues of scriptures

dont make me out to be something im not

It doesn't matter what the new generations do, what was written was written. Men change the words to suite their own fancies and it's always short-lived.

true

thats one of the reasons why these books were written in the first place it seems - to keep people scared and therefore easier to control

Your vision of The Scripture's purpose is born from what you see other people doing to and with it, not from what it's actual purpose is. Try thinking for yourself along with that 'critical thinking' method you mentioned.

read the tao te ching - which contains the same lessons as the qur'an - and tell me why they didnt resort to fear tactics in the taoist texts?

why did they teach the same lessons without threatening people with eternal damnation? or creating invisible entities with the suggestion of human attributes?

So, the fact that your words are short makes up for the fact that their empty. Do you think about these things before you type, or do you just start typing?? Considerate? Hey, if people don't want to read, they won't read. I don't really stop and ask myself, "Self, what if the amount of words in my post scares those less inclined to read away from what I type?" so it makes me no difference.

thus one would ask the question - why are you typing in the first place if you dont have a audience in mind?

isnt that the same as masturbation?

Yes, the answers are set forth. I'm typing because it's an open thread and I felt like touching on the subject. The only thing truly redeeming about all of this is seeing how many hilarious conclusions people can come up with.

i still wont turn my back on you

hopefully one day we will laugh together

Dared to keep an open mind?? No, you've dared to come up with conclusions that have no factual backing except, "It could happen".

there is factual backing if you are willing to venture outside every once in a while

its healthy to explore different places - some suggest it is what man is born to do

Don't forget, I wasn't talking to you to begin with, you approached me and not even in a decent manner. So again, if I seem mean, perhaps you should think about how you approach people before you apporach them.

i just re-read where i stepped in - and if you take a look at it - it started with me agreeing with you



funny also how Quest was the one to disagree with me initially, but as it turns out, his approach is more conducive to discussion than your confrontational nature
- take some notes

we are in this dirt together whether you like it or not

Peace

[Ultimate Fist]

Go try to find a single copy that isn't like another. Give me one chapter and verse that differs from the same numbered in another copy.

The numbering in the Torah and Gospels were invented in the middle ages. They are the same wordwise if you take the numbering out. Still, I think at least for Torahs (not so with christian bibles because they have so much sectarianism that requires manipulating verses) the numbering is the same. Show two Torah's with different numbering. Also, for Quarans, look up the Rashad Khalifa edition of the Quaran- it differs by 2 verses from normal Quarans. What does the numbering prove anyway? Logical fallacy.

[LikwidSwordz]

A lot of Bibles nowadays are mis-translated because a lot of people try to "intrepet" them from the original Greek/Hebrew scriptures. A lot of them dont translate, they intrepet. For example Gehenna/Sheol/Hades is translated into "Hell" a lot and they are definitely not the same thing. Yahweh/Jehovah is put in as "Lord". Anywayz the Bible has proved a lot so if you think it contradicts itself.....or if it was written by men without God's influence please prove that. Unless you can prove it please dont say that only men wrote it. I'm not even really sure if you guys were even talkin about this, i jus skimmed over everything. P.E.A.C.E.

[Ultimate Fist]

Read

http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/