to be a patriot is to be an idiot?

[Drunken Monk]

keep fire

[abanks47]

When you use LOTS of WORDS with no POINT that's RELEVANT to this TOPIC. People will realize you are off your rocker.

You seem to be the only one having an issue with my standpoint. I don't have an issue with yours accept for you thinking people should leave there homes for not wanting to defend it. Me using more and more words is simply me trying to get my OPINION across to you so you can respect it but you seem to be on some other shit so fuck it.

I told you already "Your history should not determine how you treat people today".
and your argument is still "1st president owned slaves and that HURTS me SO MUCH, I cannot relate to my neighbors"

You cannot be more wrong with the above statement. My history does not affect how i treat people today, in any way shape or form (maybe a bit distrustful of cops but another topic). I never said I couldn't relate to my neighbors, in fact I took your comments and ran with them. I'm currently setting up a date where for one hour straight I will hug my neighbors, because that's what its all about right? I do not consider myself a patriot because of the current government and the lies it tells. Not the lies 400 years ago just to be clear the lies in the last decade.

Correct me if Im wrong, but it sounds like in 4th of July on 1777 you wanted. Abolish Slavery, Reparations, Stop Persecuting Gays, Stop DOING ANYTHING YOU DIDN'T LIKE

OK......YOUR FUCKING WRONG DUMB BITCH. Never said it so don't assume I did.

Do you not see how some blacks don't consider 4th of July there independence day? when that day came into affect, it took nearly 100 years for them to become free. I think people are justified if they choose not to celebrate for the fact that there people were in chains when that day happened.

your mind must be narrower than a needle

My mind is narrower than a needle? really....that's the best you can come up with. Thats just terrible. Good day to you sir.

[UnequivocallyCorrect]

Abanks, the lack of "content" in your latest "responses" is getting out of hand.

SOMEHOW, you think Replying to my one-liner insults is worth anything. You should really ignore those if you want to make a point.

ITs time to show some respect to KTL.

I am sincere. I can tell there is nothing in your post except disagreements with me. These disagreements have boiled down to childish Jabs (Drunkn Monk thinks it's hott, but its becoming hollow in content)

Thus. I challenge you to argue an intelligent point.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-

I want you to TRY TO CONVINCE ME my point is wrong. That's right. "CONVINCE ME". I have been trying to CONVINCE YOU and you do nothing to CONVINCE ME.

IF you change my mind. That's how you really "win". IF I AM TOO THICK-SKULLED TO ARGUE INTELLIGENTLY WU CORP WILL JUDGE ME.

I want to learn from your "passion" but I CANNOT DECIPHER YOUR SCATTER-SHOT POSTS.

--Sincerely, Confused in SF

[UnequivocallyCorrect]

I don't know if that was supposed to be directed at me but I don't think I've implied anything that suggests thats my stance but its far from it. There are some that might be happier trading skins in Siberia (if that's what they do) than where they currently are. Why they don't move there? Several reasons. Perhaps patriotism isnt the next life value after food clothing and shelter. Or maybe its how...they dont know how to move to Siberia, pitch a tent on some land and "try" to be accepted by the neighbors.

It is directed at everyone to consider.

You: Perhaps patriotism isn't the next life value after food clothing and shelter.

I SERIOUSLY disagree. On this simplified argument.

If patriotism is the care of the fellow man. How could anyone see "that" as a low priority.

A child is wandering your streets (How fucking busy are you to HELP?!?!?!)
A woman is being attacked in the street (How fucking busy are you to HELP?!?!?!)
A man is bleeding on your doorstep (How fucking busy are you to HELP?!?!?!)
A starving family needs a loan till payday (How fucking busy are you to HELP?!?!?!)

That is why I have THE LOWEST opinion of non-patriots. THEY CANT EVEN RELATE TO THEIR NEIGHBORS. OTHERWISE THERE IS NO WAY THEY WOULD LET THOSE THINGS HAPPEN. NO WAY.

[Prolifical ENG]

If patriotism is the care of the fellow man. How could anyone see "that" as a low priority.

Looks like we are getting to extreme cases now.

It depends how low it is. If its that high in the values, instead of relaxing on the weekend after a weeks work. Do you volunteer on the weekends to clean up the neighborhood? If you do then I think very highly of you. If you have a very low opinion of anyone who doesnt volunteer then theres another problem.

There are many people that see all 4 of those examples several times a week. If it happened on a rare occasion, even the less patriotic people will help.

[UnequivocallyCorrect]

Looks like we are getting to extreme cases now.

It depends how low it is. If its that high in the values, instead of relaxing on the weekend after a weeks work. Do you volunteer on the weekends to clean up the neighborhood? If you do then I think very highly of you. If you have a very low opinion of anyone who doesnt volunteer then theres another problem.

There are many people that see all 4 of those examples several times a week. If it happened on a rare occasion, even the less patriotic people will help.

You want me to draw a line on where "care" starts and stops. So I will.

When someone is "attacked" and needs defense that is a clear time to act.
When there is a 7/11 cup and condoms littering your street, that is not a "major" priority. Im sure some dumb stuck-up bitch is crying.

But AS PATRIOTS, WE MUST BE ABLE TO THINK CRITICALLY ON WHEN SOMETHING IS IMPORTANT ENOUGH TO CARE SUPPORT AND DEFENSE of the people

Maybe next time we as citizens can stop throwing our whore condoms into the streets and put them in our pocket till we find a trash. (This action technically could be patriotic, but its a sad example when people's ability to figure out what is worth "caring, supporting, defending")

That's all. As long as the individual thinks they are honestly contributing. (Personally, I contribute in my own ways. BUT I DON'T NEED TO SHOVEL SOUP OR SUPPORT MY GOV TO BE A PATRIOT. ) Those two points are specific examples people will use to argue against the core of patriotism.

My universal NON-LITERAL definition....

Patriotism is the individual's honest intention to contribute to their contemporary local union of support.

[Prolifical ENG]

But AS PATRIOTS, WE MUST BE ABLE TO THINK CRITICALLY ON WHEN SOMETHING IS IMPORTANT ENOUGH TO CARE SUPPORT AND DEFENSE of the people

Thats true, it goes back to one of your earlier posts in this thread where you stated that many people are more patriotic than they think through those types of actions.

[UnequivocallyCorrect]

Thats true, it goes back to one of your earlier posts in this thread where you stated that many people are more patriotic than they think through those types of actions.

I really think a Soup Kitchen worker can be patriotic.
A man who pulls over to help someone with a flat can be patriotic.
Someone who drops stupid shit to keep the peace in the neighborhood can be Patriotic.
Someone who DOESN'T drop RELEVANT shit even if it means "not keeping the peace" can be Patriotic.

I knew a chick last year who was collecting Obama welfare checks.(when she had the work experience, educational background, and the looks to get a job ~ She was treating it like a vacation)

OMFG I had to set that non-patriotic bitch straight!

[Visionz]

I see patriotism as something closely related to nationalism and I find them both to be archaic modes of thought. There is one earth, there is one human race. Anything I do to make this world or my spot here in Austin Texas better doesn't have anything to do with this country, it has to do with my humanity and my awareness of the human spirit. I would be this way no matter where I was at but here is where I happen to be.

[Mumm Ra]

preach

[abanks47]

Abanks, the lack of "content" in your latest "responses" is getting out of hand.

SOMEHOW, you think Replying to my one-liner insults is worth anything. You should really ignore those if you want to make a point.

ITs time to show some respect to KTL.

I am sincere. I can tell there is nothing in your post except disagreements with me. These disagreements have boiled down to childish Jabs (Drunkn Monk thinks it's hott, but its becoming hollow in content)

Thus. I challenge you to argue an intelligent point.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-

I want you to TRY TO CONVINCE ME my point is wrong. That's right. "CONVINCE ME". I have been trying to CONVINCE YOU and you do nothing to CONVINCE ME.

IF you change my mind. That's how you really "win". IF I AM TOO THICK-SKULLED TO ARGUE INTELLIGENTLY WU CORP WILL JUDGE ME.

I want to learn from your "passion" but I CANNOT DECIPHER YOUR SCATTER-SHOT POSTS.

--Sincerely, Confused in SF

Who am I to attempt to change someones opinions, views or thoughts. If you want to think that way that's fine. I am not trying to convince you I just think that you should respect others opinions if they started out respecting yours. The only problem I have is your views on people leaving if they are not patriotic. You are proposing that a group of people, because they are different and have views that are not similar to yours, should leave the country. If you honestly do not see an issue there than you sir should be exiled. I feel that a country does not need to be patriotic in order for it to flourish.

To put it simply, I am not a patriot. I do not do the things you state out of love for my country but out of love for my fellow people, regardless of there background, race, religion, or orientation. I'd do the shit if I was in another country, so why should I take on a title that would relate it to me loving my country more than another person.

If there were two men hanging from a cliff, one American and another Canadian, out of patriotic love would you feel obligated to save the American first?

I also don't see where the hate is coming from against my posts. You hate on my shit, I will return the favor. Plain and simple. It's all good no hard feelings and apologies for the late response.

[abanks47]

I see patriotism as something closely related to nationalism and I find them both to be archaic modes of thought. There is one earth, there is one human race. Anything I do to make this world or my spot here in Austin Texas better doesn't have anything to do with this country, it has to do with my humanity and my awareness of the human spirit. I would be this way no matter where I was at but here is where I happen to be.

Pretty much how I feel, probably should have read all the posts before responding.

[UnequivocallyCorrect]

I see patriotism as something closely related to nationalism and I find them both to be archaic modes of thought. There is one earth, there is one human race. Anything I do to make this world or my spot here in Austin Texas better doesn't have anything to do with this country, it has to do with my humanity and my awareness of the human spirit. I would be this way no matter where I was at but here is where I happen to be.

Very worldly of you Visionz,
I have a very similar thought and sometimes I feel like I can relate with someone in a third-world country more than I can relate with the typical American. When worst comes to worst the starving come first. I would rather donate money towards curving starvation verse over-funding a local school.

And my argument for maintaining my patriotism. "Investing in the people of the world is part of a long-term greater importance and thus higher a priority amongst your local community." Who is anyone to judge me when I think Investing in the poor of the world will have a greater impact than funding a local school beyond minimal necessity.

I honestly think my neighbors (and extended neighbors/country) would benefit from my concern of the worlds people. Thus my patriatism is still red,white,blue

[UnequivocallyCorrect]

Who am I to attempt to change someones opinions, views or thoughts. If you want to think that way that's fine.

why would you criticize if you aren't willing to continue the debate beyond that?

The only problem I have is your views on people leaving if they are not patriotic. You are proposing that a group of people, because they are different and have views that are not similar to yours, should leave the country. If you honestly do not see an issue there than you sir should be exiled. I feel that a country does not need to be patriotic in order for it to flourish.

I bolded your text so you can see the hypocritical stance you take. Besides you disproving your own point I want to be clear "I think people who don't like where they live(and their neighbors) should leave because they will be happier somewhere else" So if you want to "disagree" with my point than look to the previous sentence on my ACTUAL stance. It also has NOTHING to do with thinking your neighborhood is better than another.

To put it simply, I am not a patriot. I do not do the things you state out of love for my country but out of love for my fellow people, regardless of there background, race, religion, or orientation. I'd do the shit if I was in another country, so why should I take on a title that would relate it to me loving my country more than another person.

I'm not sure who these "PEOPLE" your help are. Because if their AMERICANS (because you rarely leave your small county) than I'm going to call you a patriot.

I know you think a patriot supports a nation. But I'm not sure what you think MAKES UP A NATION.

If there were two men hanging from a cliff, one American and another Canadian, out of patriotic love would you feel obligated to save the American first?

That is A TERRIBLE scenario of care,support,love of ones neighbor. Here's why....

EX: If the American is my Wife, and the Canadian is my Adopted Daughter(Don't I care,support,love both?) And I knew my Wife would sacrifice herself for our daughter (Don't I care,support,love my daughter?). But me and my daughter got her adoption papers and the medical examination said the young girl had cancer and would die in a few years.(Don't I care,support,love my wifer?)

Patriotism has no relevance in saving lives! That a sick nationalist. Almost racist understanding. I think only 2-3% of people share that point of view. Almost like your arguing a patriot thinks an American is worth more than a European. You CANT think that's what a true patriot thinks! is it?

I also don't see where the hate is coming from against my posts. You hate on my shit, I will return the favor.

Before you stopped PRESENTING A CONVINCING ALTERNATIVE OPINION. So I needed to poke the newest one out of you.